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Talkback is for the residents and businesses in Liphook to voice their views and opinions about local issues and events.

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Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- paul (17th Nov 2022 - 18:20:40)

Hi.
Today the Government announcements of new measures to our economy is shocking, and the effect to our funding of local services.

We are a shrinking economic country, suffering from a low workforce after Brexit, and low investment in new business that ends up with buyers from abroad.
We are a great nation, from top universities in the world, great inventors, and enterprise. We need to pull together now and our future. We can do it (Two-world wars survived).
Let's show our future generation we can live, and enjoy life in pound-saving times.

If there are any high-hopes for the now and future generations please advise.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Sam (17th Nov 2022 - 21:08:09)

Will anyone ask the question that in the G7 and many other measures the UK is doing worse than all others.

Pandemic was everywhere.... war in Ukraine affected everyone... but why are we OFF The chart so far behind others?

Hmmm I wonder... go read the BBC article "Why is the UK economy suffering more than other countries?"

It doesn't answer it, as its both a mystery and taboo, but the charts are clear, we are probably the only country in the world actually in a worse position that we had been 3 months BEFORE The pandemic.

PS... you are "still" being lied too

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Ian (18th Nov 2022 - 21:26:52)

We’ve had it soft for too long, the nation has got lazy and complacent with emotional hypochondria dragging the country down. The challenges of next few years will hopefully reset the country’s backbone.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- passfield resident (18th Nov 2022 - 22:37:46)

Yes , of course- pensioners being scared to put on the heating, cancer patients not able to get treatment for months, mortgage payments going through the roof will all be good for us. If only we had national service back and proper punishments in schools we'd be fine. Oh for the old days.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- D (19th Nov 2022 - 12:43:03)

I'm inclined to agree with Ian. Thirty years ago the base rate went up by a quarter of a percent every month for years, peaking at 15%. Mortgage payers have been paying next to nothing in interest for over ten years now and they are moaning at nearly 3%. Stop whining!

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Jen (20th Nov 2022 - 10:22:03)

I strongly suspect that neither Ian nor D currently has a mortgage. D's comment has "I'm all right, Jack" written all over it. No doubt they are both looking forward to the 10% rise in the state pension next April and the winter fuel payment of £500 as well.

A little compassion for the stressful and difficult financial situations faced by the younger generations would not go amiss.

I was listening to Any Answers on Radio 4 yesterday afternoon and someone on there was making a strong argument for older people to contribute more in tax, perhaps by paying National Insurance, to help fund public services. It sounded like a a very sensible idea, to me.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- D (20th Nov 2022 - 10:36:39)

Jen, I am still paying a mortgage, I am not a pensioner. If you require any further information please ask. Thankyou.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Ian (20th Nov 2022 - 10:48:12)

Jen, I took out a mortgage in 1987 and saw my interest rate increase to 15%. I lost my job then my house so I think I understand hardship and adversity but like so many at that time I didn’t bleat on about my anxiety levels but picked my self up, grafted and got back on with life.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Russ (20th Nov 2022 - 11:14:29)

Why is it that this generation seem to think us older people had it so good back when we started out with a mortgage. And they seem to think we are still much better off now on a pension think again we have no choice but to make ends meet one way or another. When we were starting out we had to take two and three jobs the wife working part time house work etc just to pay the mortgage. So come on you young people loads of work out there you should be able to weather this hiccup we did .

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- er (20th Nov 2022 - 12:25:04)

No-one younger than 40ish wants to hear it but in 1985 I earnt £4,000 per anum and to buy a starter flat was around £60k, most parents were more skint than we were, no parental help with a deposit back then, so I lived in a room in a shared dilapidated Victorian house with single pane windows and no central heating, there was an electric bar fire in the shared lounge which sometimes worked, an old rug over bare floorboards which were painted black or maybe it wasn't paint and vacuum cleaners didn't have anti allergy dust filters which to be fair they didn't really need as mostly they didn't work or suck up much, washing machines were just coming in but the clothes dryer was a wooden frame in front of the bar fire that meant the lounge was always out of action!

In the mornings I had to scrape ice sheets off the inside of my bedroom window with a scraper wearing gloves, take off my scarf and overcoat, have breakfast, then go outside and try to start my car which like most cars in winter was a 50:50 chance, if it didn't start you joined the queues of living dead with their bonnet up making that endless squealing starter motor noise none of you will ever have to listen to (whilst gazing anxiously at their watches and hoping they still had a job, because you'd never get another one back then), the dawn chorus, you will never have to spray easy-start into your air intake while trying to start your car from the engine bay with frozen fingers in a blind panic!

Lunch was a cup of tea and beans on toast in the local greasy cafe on stained plastic tables with white plastic chairs where everyone from workmen to office managers would squeeze in together amongst the tramps, layabouts and confused, who would sit there all day with a cup of tea which cost 12p.You would read whichever newspaper previous customers had left behind and ignore the ketchup stains, it was considered good manners, never to complain about anything.

If you hadn't got your car started you would join the bus queue for the journey home, no-one knew when or if it would come, timetables were complete fiction, it could be 10 minutes or could be never, you waited in hope and for the first time in your day you could all share a little moan, when it finally arrived everyone somehow squeezed in armpit to armpit standing wherever they could, halfway up the stairs or in someone's lap, no-one was left behind in the cold, health and safety rules hadn't been heard of yet, no doubt this would spawn a raft of compensation claims today!

15% interest rates were the least of our worries but we did laugh a lot at each others misfortune and on the plus side I guess no one had ever yet said the words 'I am offended!', so yes maybe this will be character building!

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- I (20th Nov 2022 - 13:42:41)

re, I’m so offended by your post that is so close to bullying I feel you have harmed my mental health to the point I feel I need someone to support me until I recover.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Joe (20th Nov 2022 - 19:29:11)

Yes we did have it hard in the 60s and 70s but our expectations were a lot less it seems to me than the younger generation these days. Going for a meal out was a rare birthday treat not a weekly event - going to the pub was possibly for an hour at a time not the whole evening, and things had to be saved up for. Proportionately the cost of living was higher as white goods and even food was very expensive.
Hot water was not taken for granted. We did not have foreign holidays until the 70s and holidays were usually only once a year. I think also people did not complain immediately nor blame others for the situation we somehow just got on with working hard.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- D (Not the same one) (20th Nov 2022 - 19:42:23)

For those comparing the 80's situation, a maths question:

Would you rather give me 15% of £27,000 or 5% of £270,0000?

That's the 80's interest rate and 90% of the average house price in 1985 and the same for 2022. If you think think the 5% option is better, I take cash, cheque or BACS payment, thanks.

If you want to look at it another way would you rather give me 3 times your annual salary, or 10 times your annual salary. That's the 1985 and 2022 average house price cost to average salary ratios.


Back on t the economy, it's hard to tell what it really means to the person on the street, 10 people with £1000 each is a smaller economy than 99 people with £1 each and 1 person with £1m, but unless you are the person with £1m you are actually better off in the smaller economy.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- George (20th Nov 2022 - 20:25:45)

1992 to 2008 -BOOM! pretty good times for a lot of us. Of course there are always some that do not share the prosperity but on the whole the quality of life was pretty comfortable

2008 to 2022 the problems were there but as a nation we collectively buried our heads in the sand, blamed foreigners and ignored the black clouds on the horizon

2022 - BUST ! It’s time to balance the books and it’s going to be a tough decade……and whichever side of the political spectrum, I can’t see anyone up to the job of steering the Country through the stormy seas ahead.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- NO! I am D (20th Nov 2022 - 21:09:12)

I think the point being made here is think how much more your mortgage payments would be if the base rate was at the level of thirty years ago. We have been really lucky in having it so low for so long, it couldn't last forever. Or am I wrong in thinking we are worse off with a 2.75% base rate than 15%. ?

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Bernard (21st Nov 2022 - 18:53:12)

And don't forget that in the 70s and 80s there was MIRAS mortgage interest relief, as well as lower house prices as a proportion of salary.

I am sorry that you lost your home and job in the 80s Ian, but I am at a loss as to why you think this was no big deal ("I dusted myself off..") and that others in that position now are "bleating-on". Did you have a dependents living with you? Did you really not think this was a bad thing at the time? I remember these times and recall it was nightmare. Just because it happened then, why should we be content that it is starting to happen again now?

Tory mismanagement of the economy led to 15.4% interest rates in 1990. Tory mismanagement (and the word beginning with B that must not be spoken) has led us to our problems being worse now than other Western economies and serious issues with our public services.

I'm significantly over 40, BTW....

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- D (22nd Nov 2022 - 08:49:08)

Personally, I am grateful for the low base rate over recent years. The past ten years have been a dream come true, it has enabled me to take out a much larger mortgage than I could have thirty years ago.

At the same time I have been aware all that time that my payments will only increase. It would be foolish of me to think one percent and less would last forever. 2.75% is still ridiculously low, make the most of it.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- D (24th Nov 2022 - 07:37:58)

D (not the same one), the average house price for the time you state may have been low because that was the peak time for selling off council houses at a greatly reduced rate, thereby lowering the average price. The average may have been more the year before. I don't know anyone paying less than thirty five thousand at the time. My own mortgage then was over sixty thousand but I was working sixty hours a week to pay it for well over ten years. Everyone has a few lean years for a time, all good character building stuff.

Jen, I'm disappointed you tried to scapegoat pensioners over this issue.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Oldie (24th Nov 2022 - 11:16:07)

We have been here before several times. Remember the miners strike trying to bring down the government very bleak times. The people had to just keep going one way or another working at anything they could get . Strikes achieved nothing only higher prices. We have to adjust our way of living cut down on all the unnecessary outlays I know it will be hard but if you look at your spending you can cut corners to make ends meet. I no young people will say he doesn’t no what he’s talking about but we have been there so we do.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- passfield resident (24th Nov 2022 - 13:48:30)

Just because you were there doesn't mean you are right on everything. My opinion is that the government set out to defeat the miner's union because it had given the previous Conservative government a hard time.Watching footage of the police setting dogs on striking miners reminds me of footage of protests being put down in totalitarian regimes. I suppose that's what a lot of people would enjoy seeing happen to environmental protesters who history will show were right .

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Jen (24th Nov 2022 - 17:01:42)

@D (24th Nov 2022 - 07:37:58)

It wasn't my intention to "scapegoat pensioners", so I apologise if that's how my comment came across.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- paul (25th Nov 2022 - 14:46:18)

Hi,
The U.K. is ranked the 6th wealthiest country in the world.
Why are our NHS nurses going hungry, before the start of a 12- hour shift?
Don't remember that going on before, and I am now my senior years.

So much for public clapping on door-steps weekly, for our health staff during the Pandemic.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Bemused (25th Nov 2022 - 16:11:05)

Funny old times. My daughter’s salary is the same as the nurses now , she manages to pay a mortgage on her own run a car for work and she lives alone. She lives a good life with all the mod cons and holidays. So why are the nurses so hard up ?? that they can’t afford food .

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- paul (26th Nov 2022 - 18:17:03)

Hi,
Who is going to help us?
The new Prime Minister Sunak's government is inept of any decision to help our financial crisis. The "so called rulers" have no idea and waiting for the next election (a lot thinking of leaving anyway). We are a mess and need top-level help.
As the 6th wealthiest nation in the world, some of our citizens are starving.
Striking at work, and over stressed to doing a shift, also cannot feed their families, As a nation, we cannot live like this to future generations in the U.K.
Any ideas our local M.P. can put forward to government?

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Sam (26th Nov 2022 - 23:32:03)

Depending on what media you fall into will decide who you blame but in most cases, it won't be the ruling class and that exactly how its been designed.

Look at Bemused comments, whatever he/she is reading is suggesting the nurses are to blame, I disagree and fair play to the nurse he knows etc but that statement throws doubt on nurses.... very unfair I think

Won't be long before a visit to A&E costs 18 grand like it does in the US

As long as we all rip each other to bits then those at the top get to do what they like.


Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Joe (27th Nov 2022 - 09:15:36)

It is all very well throwing depressing comments around but is there anything an ordinary person can do about these factors in play at the moment? Probably not. People going on strike will not change anything either. A few may benefit not the majority of us. I think the original poster has a lot of time on his hands but no real change -making suggestions.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- D (27th Nov 2022 - 09:34:02)

Very good point, Sam. On this thread alone we've seen pensioners villified, persons paying mortgages thirty years ago and nurses too. I'm sure recipients of furlough payments will come along soon.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Bemused (27th Nov 2022 - 17:45:16)

Sam still bemused I didn’t say my daughter was a nurse. She is a 57 year old had several different jobs at around the same salary been made redundant a couple of times. My point was millions of people and family’s are on the same money as the nurses and make ends meet not that the nurses don’t deserve more money yes they do but so do a great number of other people. We are in very difficult time’s so we all will have to watch our expenses. As for who’s in charge in government you take your pick they all make mistakes and as history shows you it’s all happening before. I’m at a loss what 18 grand to visit A and E has got to do with nurses pay if you think about it probably make it worse if they get a massive pay rise. Summary we are all in the same boat.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- er (27th Nov 2022 - 20:09:19)

Nurses want 20% wage increase to keep up with the current inflation level. They deserve it but sadly it would probably be the end of the NHS. Currently on £35-£40k it wouldn't make them rich, but it would help, but would we be prepared to pay billions more in taxes?

Meanwhile my bank pays me 1% interest on my lifes savings!

And just to put it into perspective, the rich buy houses like this I saw today:

rightmove.co.uk/properties/129490169

Most people on Earth would consider they had arrived in style, but the wealthy trendies needing to keep up with your average Premiership player would want to scrap it all and produce what is shown in the second picture.

Who said life was fair:)

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Joe (27th Nov 2022 - 23:39:33)

But ER , just think of the heating bills on a huge house and be grateful you are not paying.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- paul (1st Dec 2022 - 17:02:01)

Hi,
This current Sunak government is not serving our country, and helping our citizens. Will the Labour Party at the next General Election be any better?
We have daily strikes across industry to Christmas, and inflation busting prices for consumers, with no end.
What are the Tories doing right now to help, and in the future?
Blaming it on Covid, and Ukraine, wears a bit thin after a long time.

A few monetary government payments help is well received, even by the rich in our society. (Helps pays towards the energy costs of indoor swimming pools)

The U.K. is going down the tubes nationally, and internationally.

We don't mind sacrifice for eventual reward policy, but is it there?

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Sam (3rd Dec 2022 - 15:44:44)

This governments playbook with the NHS is

A. Underinvestment (already happening)

B. When the pressure of A takes its toll on the staff (already happening) and they complain/strike etc to vilify those staff in the eyes of the public.

C. After years of pain from A & B make it seem like a best alternative to us all that privatisation of the NHS is the best option. (Already happening, some parts are being sold off)

D. Sell the ALL of the NHS off to their mates and make billions.

Leaving us with E. same or worse service that we have to pay through the nose for via insurance etc and still pay mind boggling fees to receive even simple and previously free treatment.

The NHS is NOT the worlds greatest health service, its staff might be but we very far behind many better systems.

You would like to think your government cares about its citizens health, that is probably the No1 job, not only are they inept, they are actively attempting to line their pockets as they make it worse.

And we voted for it

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Optimistic (3rd Dec 2022 - 17:41:10)

Everywhere is the same. France , Germany , most of the fantastic EU ?? . Things are a bit tight but it doesn’t help with all these people going on strike. What’s happen to the good old British spirit we have come through worse than this.

Let’s get working put in more hour’s South Korea did it they all worked their socks off for the country not keep on moaning .

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Bernard (5th Dec 2022 - 13:56:43)

The thing is, Optimistic, that we are bottom of the OECD's calculation of growth of G7 countries and only Russia is performing worse than us out of the G20. Nurses working harder or taking on second or third jobs is not going to resolve this. Boosterism hasn't worked either.

I'm not a Labour supporter particularly, but I think we, as a country, must give the opposition a try at the next election. The Conservatives have really made a mess of things - even Italy's often chaotic economy is performing more strongly than ours. Reliance on food banks by so many people is scandalous and it is so depressing that the nurses we were clapping during the pandemic are having to resort to strike measures just to try to earn enough to pay the bills (and the hospital car parking charges). How can investment in the NHS and our public services be so poor, when projects like HS2 are green-lit - a railway no-one was asking for?

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Optimistic (5th Dec 2022 - 16:50:52)

Well Bernard we have tried that before labour government and ended up worse off and this labour lot are far worse than the previous labour government. I don’t agree with your comments about our economy if you look at the reason we are having trouble it’s because the Union’s are trying to bring down the government that’s their only reason for strikes.

Take the train drivers do they really need more money 50 grand a year and more. Nurses on 40 grand a year ok they could do with some more but they are not on the bread line. A great many people family’s are on less and make ends meet .

I think it’s time we took stock for a start the Union’s need to be brought back into line they have accumulated millions to fund their strikes and the Union barons are on huge salary’s paid for by the working man .

This country is a fantastic country we will come back possibly better as we have before and I still think we are much better off than the continent and out of the EU .

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Jacob (5th Dec 2022 - 19:20:54)

Optimistic,

Can i ask what planet you are on? what do you mean by "nurses are not the bread line"

As you say the earn £40k that's a take home pay of £2,601.86 after tax and NI.

The average mortgage is approx £795 per month and £1,100 rent if you life in the area (2 bedroom house) council tax £220 approx, heating/electric £180 per month. House/Car insurance £80 per month, cost of filling the average car £70 per week (just to drive to work to help people in need) Cost of parking your car at the hospital £40 per week.Food shopping for one adult and two children £80per week Water £55, tv licences £14 . mobile phones £20. child care for two children, while you are work a 12 hour shift £300 aprox I don't know how much shoes uniforms are or school trips, say £20 per month contingency funds if white goods/car go wrong £50

By calculations that £2434 if you have mortgage and £2738 if you rent.


Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- D (6th Dec 2022 - 08:50:12)

Jacob, how do you think factory workers, shop workers and unskilled labourers manage on a national minimum wage of less than £20,000? Less than that if one is below 24 years of age. You're doing very well if you think £40,000 a year is a low wage.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Optimistic (6th Dec 2022 - 11:29:04)

Well said D . Jacob I think you are on another planet if you think 40 grand a year isn’t a living wage. Your calculations I see is for a single parent?? You say two children if that’s the case it takes two to have babies so child maintenance comes into it plus other factors. I said if a nurse can’t live on 40 grand a year something is wrong. As D said many family’s live on far less. Yes we are in hard times but we have seen worse people made the best of it and got on with it made ends meet. It seems the public sector workers are the ones that think they are the ones hard done by but if you look at it the private sector wage’s are much less but most ordinary workers don’t go on strike,strikes are a thing of the past they only make things worse. So Jacob come down to the real world and stop moaning if your in financial trouble then take advice and cut your out going’s to the bone there are way’s of doing that. As D has mentioned before I remember when I struggled to save enough for a mortgage and before moving in the rate went to 15% the wife not working looking after the kids so had to go out taxi driving at night it can be done.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Penny Williamson (6th Dec 2022 - 11:57:28)

D and Optimistic do make some valid points.

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- passfield resident (6th Dec 2022 - 13:27:23)

Average nurse's pay is quite a bit less than £40k a year, so no point in a discussion based on the idea that £40k is the average

Re: Will we feel the drop in living standards ?
- Pensioner (6th Dec 2022 - 17:05:09)

What about the pensioner’s they have to make do with a basic pension around £700 a month not funny. Ok a lot have topped up and taken out private pensions but that all cost a bomb . And all that on low wages today’s generation have had it good now things are a Little bit tricky they can’t manage. I think you will find the nurses are not far off 40 grand for a fully trained person and that’s a lot of money. Train drivers don’t get me started 50 grand more like a 100 and now refused a 9% wage rise and better working conditions?? . It’s all gone mad .

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