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Local Talkback
Talkback is for the residents and businesses in Liphook to voice their views and opinions about local issues and events.


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Just a Thought
- Oldie (28th May 2020 11:02:14)

Have just read that farmers are desperate for labour to bring in the crops. 70,000 people needed. Why are Healthy people sitting at home receiving money from the government when they could be earning more in the open air, up to £600 a week I see .Saving the country billions. Just read an article about Lancaster crews in w w 2 ages 18 19 20 pilots in their 20s one in 6 not coming back from their first raid . This made me think what has happened to our lovely country no one seems to care anymore.

Re: Just a Thought
- Rölli (28th May 2020 14:16:04)

likewise just been reading how smog killed thousands in the 1950's. Also smallpox, gee I miss the good old days when there was so much more to kill us than just Covid 19

Re: Just a Thought
- k (28th May 2020 14:41:28)

I believe many have applied but not being accepted

Re: Just a Thought
- Jake (28th May 2020 16:14:20)

Rolli,

I wasn't going to comment but I am going to.

"The good old days" are you being serious? Do you mean the days when black people had no rights, or when woman couldn't vote, or when LGBT+ people were murdered for being themselves?

History lesson:

In England, black people were not generally slaves instead servants both paid and unpaid, if they ran away from their jobs then there would be advertisements in papers looking for them, just like wanted posters.

Women were given the right to vote however only women who owned property and are over 30 were given this right until 1928, when the law changed and all woman were finally given the right to vote.

As Pride Month is just round the corner, I'm going to make this one longer... Lucky you!

First of, in 1951 we have Roberta Cowell who is the first known British trans woman to undergo reassignment surgery.

In 1967, The Sexual Offences Act decriminalises sex between two men over 21 and in private; this did not extend to the Military, Scotland, Northern Ireland, Channel island and the Isle of Man, sex between two men remained illegal.

In 1969, we have the 'Stonewall riots' take place in the USA, this is where members of the LGBT community fought the police against a Police raid on the Stonewall Inn in Manhattan.

In 1972, we have the first Pride march in London, around 2000 participants joined in.

In 1982, Terry Higgins dies of AIDS in St Thomas' Hospital, the Terrence Higgins Trust was set up and was the UK's first AIDS charity. A year later the, the government banned men who have intercourse with other men from donating blood.

In 1988, Margaret Thatcher introduces Section 28 of the Local Government Act 1988, this Act stated that councils must not: "promote the teaching in any maintained school of the acceptability of homosexuality as a pretended family relationship”. This meant teachers couldn't speak about same-sex relationships with their pupils.

In 1992, The WHO declassifies same-sex attraction as a mental illness.

In 1996, a case rules that an employee was about transition and was wrongfully dismissed.

In 1999, former British National Party member David Copeland bombed the Admiral Duncan, this is one of Soho's oldest LGBT bars.

In 2003, Section 28 was repelled.

In 2004, the Civil Partnership Act passes, granting civil partnership in the UK, this gave same-sex couples the same rights as married opposite-sex couples. Also in 2004, the Gender Recognition Act also passed, giving trans people full legal recognition in their appropriate gender.

In 2013, the Marriage (Same-Sex Couples) Act was passed, this legalised same-sex marriages.


And there's a lot more than that on all of the topics.

"The Good old days", no... More like 'The Bad old days'.

Re: Just a Thought
- Rölli (28th May 2020 16:34:38)

Jake, they didn't have irony either!

Re: Just a Thought
- M (28th May 2020 16:44:40)

Jake thanks for the history lesson, hope it enlightens many people, but I do think Rolli was speaking tongue in cheek?
Well done tho'

Re: Just a Thought
- D (28th May 2020 17:07:54)

Looks like a LGTB hijack to me. I've nothing against the LGTB community but do we really have to constantly have it rammed down our throats?

Re: Just a Thought
- Oldie (28th May 2020 17:09:40)

Sorry Rolli and Jake I was not on about good or bad old days. Just pointing out it seemed a bit odd people going to the beach having a good time when the farmers are so desperate to bring in the crops for us to eat and the government is paying for it. Just cannot understand why fit people especially the young cannot be asked to help. It’s a bad old time we need to pull together like The land Army did in the war.

Re: Just a Thought
- Jake (28th May 2020 17:27:47)

I don't know about that Rolli.

Re: Just a Thought
- Jennifer (28th May 2020 18:04:49)

Oldie, working at one of the fruit and vegetable farms is not as easy as you might think. All the ones I have looked at are geared up for residential workers. They have no facilities for car parking, so if you don't want to live on the farm for months then you would either have to use public transport (and then walk the rest of the way, which could be miles) or arrange for someone to drive you there and pick you up again every day.

As with most farm work, the hours are long, with 12 hours per day, 6 days per week being the norm as far as I can see from those I've looked at. In addition, the work is physically demanding. It's definitely not suitable for everyone.

Re: Just a Thought
- er (28th May 2020 18:21:49)

Jake, been on a pc British history course mate?

Blimey, bloke just advertised a job and you give us a history of British discrimination, or a selection anyway!

Did you know it wasn't till 1919 that most men got the vote. 90% of what you say applies to the rich barons and elites not the 90% of ordinary British, don't you think that worth clarifying to the uninitiated? Same with your slavery lesson.

Did you know most of the anti gay stuff which Britain stopped still goes on in 90% of the world, forget bad British past, how do you feel about Africa present and are you campaigning much?

Did you know slavery was endemic to Africa for thousands of years and African ships used to raid British and other European villages for hundreds of years, enslaving millions of white men, women and children? How angry are you about that? (I'm guessing like about none, doesn't meet the criteria).

Did you know 99% of Britains never owned slaves ever, (again the 10% or more like the 1%) most Britains lived in poverty.

There was never slavery in Britain since probably pre Norman times and then it was the Vikings and most of what you describe about adverts to track down black servants, making it sound almost normal every day, was actually extremely rare at best.

Did you know when British traders did finally go to Africa to trade they didn't expect to be offered slaves at all, but the slave trade in Africa was long thriving, it was the AFRICANS who captured and sold their own neighbours long time past, the white traders didn't dare venture into Africa beyond their ships for they would be KILLED as white intruders, instead remaining in their ships for safety whilst the African traders brought them their own people to get rich? How angry are you about them as well? Is that an indictment of terrible African past or just the people involved?? Of course those who made the trade were all AS guilty, but will you acknowledge it was an African trade?

Did you know many Ghanaians still hate Nigerians because Ghanaians were mostly captives and the slave gangs Nigerian tribes? Do you criticise Nigeria much?

And most IMPORTANTLY most ordinary British people were so appalled, we were the first in the world to BAN slavery completely which carried on in Africa and Asia for long after and still does in many places even today.

What are you doing about that? (I'm guessing maybe nothing cos the course only taught you the 'pc' bad British stuff, I wonder what the rationale was behind that!!)

If you're going to do the moral high ground do it 100%, not just the easy targets in British history, Britain has long acknowledged and repented for it's past, most haven't and won't.

Anyway, bloke only mentioned fruit picking. What a song and dance that leads us to gender transition operations and The British National Party, gotta love Talkback!

Re: Just a Thought
- Jake (28th May 2020 19:09:07)

D,

What exactly is an LGBT hijack? Your not having it constantly rammed down your throats at all. I felt it would be a good idea to do a small run down of LGBT history as relevant with the post as it is Pride month next month. You have nothing against gays that's cool, are you an ally then?


er,

No, I haven't been on a course, it's simple general knowledge about our history. I also stated that they were servants not slaves, which were sometimes paid sometimes not. I also went with British history (and one point was American ('Stonewall Riots')) as we are British afterall.

Oldie,

My posts weren't aimed at you, they were aimed at Rolli. I agree with you that if you are healthy, you should do something instead of sit down all the time watching TV.

Re: Just a Thought
- Oldie (28th May 2020 19:22:36)

Yes Jeniffer it’s hard work I have done it many times 12hr shifts. That’s why I said the younger generation could do it live in leave home for a few weeks earn some money to help out mum and dad it would do some 1718 19 20 year olds a lot of good. It might make them realise that food doesn’t grow in supermarkets. The seasonal workers from abroad do it standing on their heads.

Re: Just a Thought
- sarah (28th May 2020 19:40:20)

er you are the best.

Re: Just a Thought
- Ian (28th May 2020 19:50:11)

Oh Jake, keep flying the rainbow mate OR you could chill out and recognise that the vast majority of the UK are now so tolerant that someone’s gender or sexuality is a completely irrelevant. Oh, of course that would mean you would have to stop hiding behind victimhood!

Re: Just a Thought
- Jake (28th May 2020 20:40:06)

Ian,

Please educate yourself. If this country was so equal then we wouldn't need a pride month. Pride month isn't just about celebrating how far we have come, but that things still need to change. Check out stonewall they have some good statistics and facts!

I don't want to be changing the thread from its original matter, I was responding to Rolli. if you want to make a new thread about the issue feel free or I might!

Re: Just a Thought
- Ian (28th May 2020 21:31:17)

Jake, read Rollis post again, you’re missing the point! As someone else pointed out (which you also missed) he was being tongue in cheek, quite obvious really!

Re: Just a Thought
- D (28th May 2020 21:35:18)

Jake, you have hijacked this thread because it's original subject matter concerned harvesting. NOT homosexuals, lesbians, bisexuals and transexuals.

Re: Just a Thought
- Helen (28th May 2020 21:37:26)

Ridiculous to think that we have true equality in this country. One only has to look at the derogatory comments on this website alone aimed at women. "Calm down dear" or "You are a bored woman with too much time on your hands who does not understand politics"

Re: Just a Thought
- Dawn Hoskins (29th May 2020 12:49:45)

Maybe we could start this tread again [Oldie?] with information about how to apply for farm jobs or other work outside in the fresh air?

It may be useful for any fit and healthy people looking for work, many of whom would really appreciate the extra money.

Re: Just a Thought
- Oldie (29th May 2020 13:56:23)

Well Dawn I think it’s a waste of time because as you can see 95% of the thread is total rubbish . Nobody wants to work especially the young people there is plenty of well paid work out there but it’s hard graft something the young are not used to.

It’s been on Facebook for several weeks the Farmers Weekly. I know I’m old but back in the 50s you left school at 15 and started work the following week come what may. I remember my first day in the middle of a field cutting kale by hand so cold and wet and then carrying in to the barn for the cattle. That’s a long time ago but the principle is the same. As Mr Norman Tebbit said get on your bike.

Re: Just a Thought
- Rölli (29th May 2020 15:19:13)

Oldie, times change, that's why we get old and leave this place, As we age we can no longer adapt to the inevitability of change and the world leaves us behind. Its not wrong or bad, its just the circle of life, and I guess it what makes our passing more welcome.

Re: Just a Thought
- Joe (29th May 2020 15:30:42)

I have heard though that the farmers do not want to employ people on furlough as they will leave the moment the office calls them. They require people who will commit for more than a few weeks. Also they prefer those who are able to live in their caravans and live on site for the reason that they may not have enough space for workers cars, plus too many people coming and going increases the risk of bringing in the virus

Re: Just a Thought
- passfield resident (29th May 2020 17:25:22)

We're finding out now just how much we need people from abroad to do various jobs.

Re: Just a Thought
- A.R (29th May 2020 20:26:15)

No Passfield resident , we have to re educate our society that you have to work. Labour , who I voted for has caused this. You are just basically enabling slave labour , which in any other form would seem wrong

Re: Just a Thought
- passfield resident (30th May 2020 10:07:45)

How would you re-educate people?

Re: Just a Thought
- Jennifer (30th May 2020 10:24:23)

... and also, A. R., presumably we will have to re-educate people to accept that many foods are likely to become much more expensive in the future. We have been living in a bubble created by the easy free movement of the workforce. Undoubtedly, farmers' costs will rise and those will be passed on to the consumer in price rises.

I'm not saying that this is a bad thing: it's merely a consequence of changes in the nature of the workforce.

Re: Just a Thought
- passfield resident (30th May 2020 11:42:54)

Jennifer-you've hit the nail on the head. Cheap labour (often from abroad) means cheaper food in the supermarkets. If we don't want to pay more we need to keep on using the cheap labour. In some ways we are a wealthy, spoiled society that wants plentiful, cheap food without facing the consequences. I remember potato picking as a holiday job a long time ago- it was very hard work and most people I know wouldn't want to do it. We get foreign labour in, pay them poorly and often put them in rubbish accomodation so we get our cheap potatoes, the same way we have cheap clothes because people in countries like Bangladesh are working like slave labourers. We may not want to think about it, but we're involved in it when we spend our money

Re: Just a Thought
- optimist (30th May 2020 15:03:10)

passfield resident

'We're finding out now just how much we need people from abroad to do various jobs.'

That sums up negativity, hopeless, are we not even going to try and change, just pile foreigners in cheaper, forget our young folk, too much hassle, demoralised, quick buck, shallow, short sighted, given up, attitude to both our young and foreign youth too who are all more than that.

Let's change please, won't get a better wake up call, chance to get our youth off their backsides and motivated, training or lose benefits, not hairdressing but medicine, science, computer, please help, don't kick, everybody gives up eventually if we just keep undercutting them and topping up with benefit street and cheap drugs and lost towns..

Let's get them motivated to work and make, to be part again and break our easy addiction to cheap poor people and expecting nothing much from our youth, someone criticised Patel but at least she understands the need to try and get our own folk working first and I trust her more to do that than any lefties and liberals out there, she is not stupid, only thing that will undermine her is ourselves!..

Re: Just a Thought
- passfield resident (30th May 2020 17:37:01)

Nothing negative about it-it's just a fact of economics that people travel where there's work . I like the idea of living in a multi-cultural society and have enjoyed living in areas full of hardworking immigrants. I'd much prefer their company to that of those people in our underclass who have given up on the idea of society and don't want to be contributors to it.Oh, and I'm not a leftie or a liberal.

Re: Just a Thought
- Helen (30th May 2020 23:05:18)

Employers can be forgiven for wanting hard workers. If employers find british workers to be hard working they would employ them. Not every one can be a doctor or lawyer though we need people to do the basic jobs. What I find depressing is the amount of debt young people get themselves into doing university courses which do not get them into a good job at the end of it, and they end up having to take the lower level jobs which do not need a degree and still have the debt to pay.

Re: Just a Thought
- Owen (31st May 2020 08:07:02)

So now you are all pro youth, when it's convenient for you. Now you want them to live their lives. Maybe if we didn't cut youth funding maybe they would be they would be more inclined to help.

Re: Just a Thought
- Oldie (1st Jun 2020 11:06:24)

As I started this thread I thought it was time to put it to bed.Its been a great debate lots of positive thoughts I can see it has got people thinking. We need to change the way we encourage people to work society has become to reliant on hand outs from the government.

So here goes go back to you have to take a job what ever it is if you are capable of doing it if you refuse your money is stopped from the government. All this you have to go to university has got to stop only people that need a degree for their chosen career should go stop all these Micky mouse courses.

Encourage more apprenticeships make money available to firms to help offset the cost. If you can bring your self to read John Humphrys in Saturdays Daily Mail he hits the nail on the head.

Owen I don’t know how old you are but you still don’t seem to get it you have to work for what you want you are not owed a living.

Just a last point, I didn’t stay in that field, by the time I was 16 I had saved enough money to buy a decent motorcycle and landed a job in a large agricultural engineering company and my life took off. I ended my working life running my own business for 37 years very successfully. So there is so much out there for the young people of today go for it.

Re: Just a Thought
- Rob (1st Jun 2020 22:42:40)

What about all those perfectly healthy benefit scroungers sitting at home, they could go and work for their money too. Just saying

Re: Just a Thought
- Oldie (2nd Jun 2020 09:16:27)

I was not going to post any more but I totally agree Rob I did include it in my post.

Re: Just a Thought
- Pensions Too (2nd Jun 2020 12:00:51)

We should also scrap the Pension triple lock too. Stop all that scrounging off the state by old and experienced scroungers

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