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Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Kenn (4th Dec 2005 - 00:42:12) On Friday morning I was totally disgusted to see a woman drive down School Close, talking on a mobile phone while trying to turn the corner into the Avenue. If you can remember Friday morning was a very wet and windy morning. There were more cars than normal on the road and indeed more children too. How long is it before a child is seriously injured or killed by the inconsideration of these stupid people. I was also told of a case of a woman in a 4x4 who mounted the pavement near the school narrowly missing a Mother and her Children. School close is a very conjested road during school drop off and pick up times. We should laminate the number of the local police station and stick it to the lamp posts in this area and if we see anyone on a mobile while driving report them. On Friday I challenged the driver who promptly droppped the phone. Surely a child's safety is more important than any telephone conversation. What do you think we can do about this problem before something tragic happens to ONE OF OUR OWN CHILDREN.

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - S (5th Dec 2005 - 11:34:42) Did you not realise that between the time frame of 8am and 9am the road is owned by inconsiderate women drivers in 4x4's who need to drive the 400 yards to take their kids to school cos they are too bloody lazy to walk. Nothing will happen until it's too late, that you be sure of.

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - MG (5th Dec 2005 - 13:44:22) Being a resident of The Avenue, a parent of children at the school and someone who has to drive down The Avenue to get to work, I well understand the problems with parking etc at school drop off times. You are never going to persuade some people to walk their children to school, or park away from The Avenue/Avenue Close and walk in. I do understand that some people have to drop their kids and go straight to work but they could use the layby in Longmoor Road to drop their children off so they can walk up the alleyway to school safely. I have children at the school and also have to drive down The Avenue to the Headley Road junction (after walking my children to school I hasten to add!) every morning at about 8.45. The biggest problem that I see is drivers who park on The Avenue on the left hand side between the Headley Road junction and Avenue Close. Just about every day cars heading towards the junction down The Avenue have to mount the kerb to get past cars coming in the other direction towards school. This is because they cannot see down the road due to a slight bend in the road at Avenue Close and obviously a lot of traffic is coming up it and there are cars parked all the way along one side of the road. If these cars didn't mount the kerb no-one could go anywhere as the traffic coming from the Headley Road has nowhere else to go. I'm not suggesting for a moment that this is a good option, but it is sometimes the only option. Thankfully very few children walk on the pavement on that side of the road, but yes it is potentially dangerous. This also impacts heavily on traffic on the Headley Road as drivers trying to turn right into The Avenue can't, and more often than not a queue is forming in the other direction because cars turning left cannot enter The Avenue either! I personally feel that the section of The Avenue between Headley Road and Avenue Close should be strictly no parking to allow a freer flow of traffic. A couple of yellow lines there would work wonders!

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - S (5th Dec 2005 - 17:10:20) They do use the layby on the Longmoor Road and they do use the Longmoor road leaving their cars parked all the way up the side of it on even on a blind bend.

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - MG (5th Dec 2005 - 18:36:20) S, I quite agree! I wish that people had the sense to just drive into the lay-by and drop off! Parking along the Longmoor Road is a nightmare, and I've noticed recently that people have started to park all the way back to the junction with The Avenue, making turning right out of that end of The Avenue absolutely treacherous! But obviously parents are going to continue to want to take their children into school (mainly because we are talking about 4-11 year olds here). As far as I can see, parents should take on board that parking around the schools is very limited, and they should park further away and walk in. I can't believe there hasn't been a serious accident along Longmoor Road. I understood that some while ago some plans were made to restrict parking along Longmoor Road on the Bohunt side of the road - does anyone know what's happening about this?

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Kenn (5th Dec 2005 - 22:47:55) It just goes to show me how narrow minded people are with the reply that S has posted. It's not only women drivers that drive their children to school - there are some men who also drive. Double yellow line would make no difference to these people. They also park on the white zig- zag by the school gates. Perhaps it should be a resident/school staff only zone. Nothing will be done about this until a child is seriously injured or killed.

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - toots (5th Dec 2005 - 23:24:01) Perhaps a walking 'BUS' could be set up from strategic points around the village to walk groups of kids into school. That way we could encourage parents to drop their children at safer, less congested areas and the kids would benefit from some exercise. I'm sure we could round up some willing volunteer parents. Anyone agree? Fine it won't solve all the congestion issues but from little acorns.....

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - MG (6th Dec 2005 - 09:15:54) A walking bus was tried a few years ago at the Infant School, but there weren't enough volunteers to keep it going! I agree this would be a great idea but you have to remember that many of the very young children wouldn't want to be taken into school with someone other than a parent. Perhaps the Junior School could try it though? Maybe Avenue Close should be a completely no go area for parents at school drop off/pick up times?

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Ben Lawrance (6th Dec 2005 - 14:24:31) As a resident of The Avenue (a stones throw from the school) I understand exactly what people are saying about the parking between Headley road and Avenue close. I seem to recall, a few years ago, that they were planning to use a bit of the playing field at the back of the school to use as a "drop off point" Not too sure what the outcome was. Anyone know??

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - LippyChick (6th Dec 2005 - 16:36:05) I was one of the volunteers of the walking bus when it was established in approx 2000. Sue Lewis the former head of the Infant School was the brainchild behind it, and it worked very well, but only for a short period of time. The problem was the essential adult/child ratio that was necessary to conform with safety rules. If I remember rightly this ratio was 1:4. I had one child at the school, and two younger toddlers. This meant that I could only watch one other child on the walk, and many other parents were in the same situation. The bus also operated only in the mornings, as it was deemed important that parents had the opportunity to see class teachers after school. I'm not sure if the bus could be rethought, it was rather a good idea at the time. I have had occasion to complain to the local police several times about dangerous driving in Avenue Close and The Avenue. We all want to deliver our children safely to school, but cannot do that to the detriment of other children who may be nearby. The local police were very helpful, and do on occasion pay a visit to The Avenue at busy periods which has an amazing effect on the quality of the driving! Perhaps anyone who witnesses bad or dangerous driving should contact the Police, who surely, with a large volume of complaints will lend their weight to helping solve the issues. This problem has been ongoing for many years, and I doubt very much that a solution can be found quickly, easily or to everyone's satisfaction. The layby in the Longmoor Road can be an excellent option, if only it were used properly, rather than by parents who simply open car doors at the nearest possible point to the alley thus blocking other drivers from entering, and therefore increasing the hazard. Dare I say, that the lack of pedestrian crossings has some impact on whether or not people walk their children to school, or whether they children are able to walk on their own. The zebra crossing in the square has had a positive impact, but there are no formal crossings to get children to either the Longmoor Road entrance, or The Avenue entrance. I would suggest that the problem needs looking at from a village level, rather than looking at one blackspot on it's own.

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Keith Ireland (3rd Jan 2006 - 22:58:41) I was almost gridlocked the other night in Church Lane Bramshott at 11.15pm between Christmas eve Services and then read this string, with renewed enthusiasm ! Two things struck me about the various comments, one of which is the typical emotive comment " what does it take.....until a child is hurt or killed before....." Well why not use our imaginations, before an accident occurs. What difference would an accident actually make ? Cetainly there would be increased anger, frustration and finger pointing, but what solution, short,medium or long term is available ? Is it a matter of money/Council budgets ? Or a problem that actually will never go away ? The only positive idea I can add is this: build a new infant school on the remaining OSU land (close to station,buses and new housing estates etc). Then release the existing Infant school builing to the Juinor school to develop/grow into. Halve the traffic flowing through the Avenue etc.......just dreaming. Anybody got a magic wand ?

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - LippyChick (4th Jan 2006 - 08:19:11) Hiya Keith Great Idea! No! Seriously! The only downside that I can see is that parents that have to deliver and collect children from both the infant and junior schools would then have a logistical nightmare. These things can be got around. Alternatively, why not move both schools over to that site, there is plenty of space. Sure it would take budget, but it would relieve a hell of a lot of congestion and problems for residents. What would happen to the existing land though? housing development? I fear so, which would simply continue the traffic problems in that area :( Lips x

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Jay (5th Jan 2006 - 00:20:29) Whatever happened to children walking to school? Surely anyone over the age of 7 or 8 who lives anywhere in Liphook is within walking distance of the schools? Don't older brothers and sisters walk with younger ones any more? Don't parents walk their children to school? Are children no longer capable of walking alone? If all the Liphook children arrived on foot, the traffic would significantly diminish and the children would be getting more exercise to boot!

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Paul Robinson (5th Jan 2006 - 07:49:08) This thread has rather strayed from its original point of mobile phone usage back to the perenniel subject of access for vehicles delivering and picking up children from Liphook Infants and Junior Schools. Can I suggest that one way of easing the flow of traffic and reducing the parking on the Avenue and Avenue Close would be to put a slip road or drive into the strip of School playing field that currently borders The Avenue. At present this piece of land does not appear to be in regular use as it sports a stand of silver birch trees and long tussocky grass which is not cut because of the trees. The whole is also the resting place for litter chucked over the fence by those thoughtful enough not to drop it on the pavement! Provided the work is not given to the same company that replaced the pavement outside the old Coyte's shop, this could be done for a reasonable cost and if a one way system were introduced with an access from the Headley Road end and exit at the Lowsley end the flow of traffic, whilst not reduced, would at least be more manageable. Paul Robinson

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Keith Ireland (6th Jan 2006 - 00:45:48) Paul, I agree with your ideas for a short term solution, and to develop unused (or little used) strips of land within the school boundaries. (What did Churchers Junior school do ?) That was my first thought but on reflection this is not the long term solution, whilst new homes are being built everywhere. In Liphook.In Hampshire. Just how big will Liphook get before even the Council agree that classrooms are too full ? The roads are not adequate for the amount of traffic. Did the Planners think that Liphook's population would remain static forever ? Returning to the subject of this string....how will we or the police ever enforce the law about (not) making phone calls whilst attempting to drive ? Kenn had the right idea when he challenged the driver. Perhaps if we all challenged driver/mobile phone users more often and were brave enough to face confrontation, more people would phone when parked/stopped...or put their phones on to Voicemail. Tickets please !

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Gember Noot (25th Feb 2006 - 18:31:54) I was driving through the Square on Friday night and spotted to yellow coated police officers booking a man who they had flagged down for talking on his mobile phone while driving. Yupee! It's a shame that they are not seen during daylight hours. The fines could be used to pay for the crossing that I understood was being put somewhere on the Headly Road near the Avenue junction to assist and encourage mums and their children to walk to school.

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Freddie Dawkins (27th Feb 2006 - 11:42:30) Gember - A pedestrian crossing near the junction of The Avenue and Headley Road is something we've wanted for a long time - and it's going to happen! Sam James (our County Councillor) has been leading the lobbying in Winchester to get a crossing and Hampshire County Council have agreed to it and found the money. It's imminent - but I don't have a final date yet. It will be a Zebra crossing, just back from the junction so it doesn't cause traffic problems for cars turning and also the flashing lights will not be shining directly into windows of the properties along that stretch of road. rgds Freddie Dawkins Parish Councillor

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Eneida (27th Feb 2006 - 14:18:42) Hi Freddie, Considering the speed drivers go along the Headley Road do you really think a Zebra Crossing is a good idea? I'm not so sure. Eneida

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Mike Grimes (28th Feb 2006 - 01:03:11) Eneida, Have you lost it? You are usually so sensible. Do you really think that it would be a bad idea to have a crossing that allows children to cross the road safely? I presume that you perceive the speed of vehicles in Headley road to be too high, but I do not see how a crossing would make that worse. It might, however, mean annoying blinking yellow lights all night long for some residents. It's the £50,000 cost of a bit of paint and a couple of light bulbs that galls me.

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Freddie Dawkins (28th Feb 2006 - 14:30:44) Hi, Eneida - Good point but it's a difficult one. The highways engineers have looked long and hard at the situation and have made their recommendation and we have been given the green light on it. I suppose only time will tell how effective the crossing will be. But the general problem of speeding is something else. How do you edcuate drivers to observe speed limits - especially in built up areas and near schools? Just putting up signs does not work, that's for sure. Maybe we should lobby for permanent speed cameras around the village? Would they help? rgds Freddie

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Terri (28th Feb 2006 - 14:51:42) On the subject of lazy parents refusing to walk to school with their children - don't even get me started!! There are a few people who need to do this. 98% do not. My son was killed by someone plugging in their mobile phone to recharge it, so they weren't looking at the road. You really don't want to know how I feel about the use of mobile phones in cars!

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Eneida (28th Feb 2006 - 16:08:14) Hi Mike, How nice to hear your dulcet tones again :) No, I haven't lost it....what concerns me about a Zebra crossing is a combination of the speed of cars plus the fact that the Headley Road is not well lit in the dark mornings and evenings. I think a safe crossing is vital, but I would have thought a Pelican might have been more visible from a longer distance. I fear drivers might be taken by surprise by a Zebra and not be able to stop in time. Of course, that's just my humble opinion. Eneida PS Hi Terri!! and Freddie of course.

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Chris (28th Feb 2006 - 16:12:27) Freddie, "permanent speed cameras around the village..." Great idea...and they would work.

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Janet (4th Mar 2006 - 20:45:15) I'm delighted to hear that there's to be a zebra crossing near The Avenue. It's about time. How about a safe crossing at Passfield? And while we're at it, please could we have the speed limit reduced from 50 to 40? It seems ludicrous to me that the speed limit goes up just as you approach the village with all its hidden driveways, children crossing, crossroads, Post Office carpark etc etc.

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Freddie Dawkins (5th Mar 2006 - 18:18:39) Just some extra general observations from my experience: 1. I don't believe any driver always obeys all speed limits. 2. It might be deliberate, it might be by accident, but I'm sure everyone speeds at some times. 3. If we look at Liphook in particular: - We have a small area, called The Square. We have five busy roads feeding into The Square. - These roads, if we start from The Square, are narrow and congested. As they lead away from The Square and the village centre, they open up a bit. But they are still country roads. 4. We have lots of speed limit signs, repeater signs, road markings, etc. 5. Yet, after 12 years living in Liphook, I've seen no improvement in driving, from the point of view of speeding, observation, courtesy to pedestrians, etc. 6. So, even with all the money that's been spent by Hampshire County Council's highways team in Liphook, I don't believe it's a safer area, for drivers or pedestrians. 7. In various conversations I've had with highways people, they are pragmatic. They say, for instance, there's no point trying to introduce a speed limit that's going to be plainly ignored. 8. Maybe a good example of that is the stretch of Headley Road from, say, the A3 bridge to Passfield, and then from Passfield through to Lindford. 9. A question: does it make sense to have a 40mph speed limit from outside The Links through to past The Black Fox? 10. Should Portsmouth Road, from the sorting office, to The Links be 30mph? 11. I'm not preferring any of these measures - just posing some questions. 12. If everyone who reads this site, and drives, can check their speed every time they drive through the village in the next seven days, and see exactly what speed they are driving at, I bet there will be a few surprised people. 13. Sure, cameras might be a deterrent. But they are not a solution. They are part of possible solution. But driver education has to be the most important factor in all of this. 14. Why don't we, as a community, ask Hampshire Police to install a camera or two, and let's then see what, if any, difference is made? rgds to all here Freddie

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Gember (7th Mar 2006 - 09:38:48) Yes please Freddie, who does the asking, and what buttons do we need to press? I do not think we need camera's just the flashing speed signs may make a difference - perhaps they could be trialled? Gember

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Finchie (7th Mar 2006 - 12:16:55) I'm with Eneida on this one. I think a zebra crossing in that location is too easy for a driver to miss/ignore ... 1/ I think the location is just when the "boy racers" start to put their foot down coming out of town 2/ Bearing in mind it is essentially a kids crossing for the school - the kids might be confused as to who has right of way. Having diligently learnt their highway code, they might think they have right of way with a foot on the crossing ! 3/ My own observations on the new one is Liphook square is that people are often ignored (even though the traffic is only going 10mph), and people still expect traffic to stop 10 meters up on the funny coloured bricks Ideally it should be proper crossing with lights and audible signals (quite understanding this would be a nightmare for local residents - so not sure if there is an option to turn the beeps off?), but I suppose something is better than nothing ! Alex - you have been very quiet recently - but I know you understand technology. How about beeps transmitted via bluetooth to kids iPods ? It's the future! As for the speed camera argument - 80% of the traffic must be local. Once everybody knows where they are placed they will be ineffective. The Camera Partnerships must have already worked out this would be a low revenue stream for them, otherwise we would have had them years ago !! Cheers, Finchie

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Chris (10th Mar 2006 - 12:59:33) Freddie, Speed limit regulations have definitely improved the situation beyond the A3 flyover to passfield, especially those actions taken to prevent accidents at the bend on the southerly approach. These changes were definitley needed for safety's sake, but were never enough to prevent people from breaking the law. It's a shame that some idiots believe that the road is still part of a TT or F4 circuit.

Re: Using mobile phones while driving to/from school - Philip (17th Mar 2006 - 14:52:54) Quote: "On Friday I challenged the driver who promptly droppped the phone. " Whilst this thread has most definitely strayed, can I just point out that it is the Police who should be enforcing such laws, not 'bothered' individuals. I have no argument re. Road Safety / Pedestian crossing improvements etc, but there is a fine line between upholding the law and taking on the responsibility for enforcing it.

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