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Where is the transparancy? - Phelim McIntyre (5th Aug 2011 - 14:49:05) As someone who looks at the Parish Council's notice board to see what meetings are going on, what meetings have happened, and the minutes are there I notice that since the new Parish Council was elected there seems to be a drought of information. While I know that the Parish Council does not have to publish the minutes of working groups the fact that the last Parish Council did publish this information while the new one, where many of the candidates stood on a platform of "anti-corruption", "openness" and "transparancy" does not speaks of secrecy and clandestine meetings where cronyism is the name of the day.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - helen (5th Aug 2011 - 15:38:38) I have just checked back on the PCs website and there are very few minutes of working parties from previous years. Do you attend meetings? why not ask then for any information from any working parties? If it is sensitive info then perhaps it is why they are not publishing minutes. I can think of more important things to worry about!

Re: Where is the transparancy? - David (5th Aug 2011 - 16:43:43) What matters would you describe as "sensitive" and who decides which matters should be treated as such? Are we quickly returning to "the bad old days"?

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Phil (5th Aug 2011 - 21:53:03) "Sensitive" ... ? What on earth happens at PC level in rural England that anyone could ever consider 'sensitive' ... ! Or maybe that's the problem - in the face of shattering global disasters / continental drought / economic crisis that rural / local politics thinks it is more important than it actually is? (Will sit back and await the hail of bricks ....!)

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Hamish (16th Aug 2011 - 12:58:12) Transparency, you say! It is now 16th August and still the Minutes of the F & P Committee [11th July Meeting] have not appeared on the PC website. I note from the agenda that not only did the meeting take place in the Millennium Hall [strange] but, also, both the Clerk and the Deputy Clerk appear to have been replaced by a councillor for that meeting. Transparent? You excluded the only two individuals whose main responsibility is to accurately record the proceedings and publish in a timely manner for the information of parishioners. If you can\'t publish the \'open\' session minutes, I shudder to think what goes on in a \'closed\' session! Hamish.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - dawn hoskins (16th Aug 2011 - 19:17:35) No. You should get your fact correct. They were not excluded at all. They were invited to attend just as any other person in the village is. If they chose not to that is their choice. A Councillor was directed to clerk the meeting as the content of the meeting concerned the staff (as those present will know). I do not know why the minutes are not on the website, but I will find out tommorrow and put the answer on this site. It could be something to do with the fact that no meetings take place in August? From my limited experience, the minutes from the previous month's meeting are agreed by the Committee as 'acurate' at the next month's meeting. They have to be signed off as correct at a committee meeting. I don't think there has been a Finance and Policy meeting since July - so that could be the problem, but as i said, I will check this out. I hope this is helpful.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Dawn Hoskins (17th Aug 2011 - 15:26:10) OK - Fact finding mission accomplished. The last Finance and policy meeting was on July 11th. The minutes from this are voted on (and approved if accurate) at the next monthly meeting cycle of the Finance and Policy committee. In this case it will be September 12th. The last Millennium Centre Management meeting was on July 14th. The minutes from this are voted on (and approved if accurate) at the next monthly meeting cycle of the Millennium Centre Management committee. In this case it will be the 15th of September. The last Planning meeting was on 18th July. The minutes from this are voted on (and approved if accurate) at the next monthly meeting cycle of the planning committee. In this case it will be the 19th of September. The Full Council meet on the last Monday of each month. If any draft minutes have been printed in time for this [3 clear working days before hand] they are sent out with the Agenda and then they can be voted on. The deadline for having any draft minutes sent out for the last full Council meeting was the 19th July the F&P minutes were not send with the Agenda as they were not done. I am new at this, but apparently it is quite normal for minutes to run on a monthly meeting cycle. The old council used to put up on the website the minutes which had not yet been approved. This practice has been frowned upon and the new Council have been advised to only put on the web site the ‘approved’ minutes which have been voted on. I have spoken to the Chairperson of the Council today [Cllr Hope] and she agreed that the draft F&P minutes can be posted out to every councillor. The accuracy of the minutes will be voted on at the next Finance and Policy meeting [on the 12th September] which is the earliest opportunity in any event. I propose to put forward a motion that we do not have a month off in August. I realise that Parliament do it - but I don't think it would be too difficult to have August meetings. I am told that this has always happened because so many people are away, but as long as there is a quorum I can't see the problem. At least it would prevent people getting impatient about minutes being put on the website.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Hamish. (17th Aug 2011 - 16:20:38) More obfuscation! You say the Clerks were invited to attend but chose not to.Is there evidence of that? It is well known that all parishioners are invited to attend before the exempt session commences. You refer to "staff matters" as the reason why both Clerks were not required to take the minutes . My understanding is that such subjects are usually discussed in the exempt session. Therefore, surely, they could have minuted the meeting up until that time. The Councillor might then have taken charge of the Minutes for the exempt session - having asked the Clerks to leave with the other parishioners. I might be putting one and one to-gether to make three but it would seem to me that the staffing matter must have been quite personal to them to prevent them from doing their job! I'm sorry, but your explanation seems even less transparent. With regard to the Minutes of the meeting, I also note that they still have not appeared on the website for all to see. They seem to have been listed in the Past Minutes column but without a hyper-link. I say again, WHERE THE MINUTES? Hamish.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Dawn Hoskins (17th Aug 2011 - 18:11:37) Mr Hamish. This thread is entitled “where is the transparency”. We all agree with being transparent, that is the platform that a number of us got elected on and also the reason why all these matters were discussed in open public session. I have explained very clearly what the situation is, after taking the trouble to find it out. I am only passing on the information as I have been told it – so you don’t need to shoot the messenger. I do not think there is any ‘obfuscation’ as you put it. For your information: I have submitted a Motion today at the Parish Office that the August holiday breaks be scrapped. As long as there are enough Members attending each meeting there will (if the motion is voted in) no longer be an extended wait for approval of minutes every Summer. I’m sure you will be happy with that Mr Hamish (if that is possible). If, Mr Hamish, you would like to introduce yourself to me, I can go through the process as far as I understand it (or any other Councillor can). As you do not put your full name I doubt whether you will want to do that, so until then, I SAY AGAIN – the minutes will be published when they are approved.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Stephen (17th Aug 2011 - 19:03:45) Transparency, what a joke. So who told Dawn Hoskins if she is the messenger. Perhaps she or somebody else could tell us.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Hamish. (25th Aug 2011 - 15:29:18) Well done, Steve. Could not agree more. First, obfuscation now obscuration. Where are the Minutes? I thought Asterix was the star of a French comic. Why is he shown all over the web-site? Accompanied by his mate "No Minutes Published" [NMP]? We know there are no NMP's - because they are not on the web-site. My brothers, who attended the last full Council meeting, told me that the Chairwoman made a point of remonstrating with Councillor Croucher [Chairman of F&P] about the absence of the Minutes and he assured her they would be available in "a matter of days." [this was on 25 July.] I fail to see why draft Minutes can not be displayed on the website when there is always a 'disclaimer' until they have been approved. Transparency? I say again - "Where are the Minutes?" Remember that there is a District election about to take place with members of the Parish Council standing, so don't alienate voters by ignoring a simple request for... the Minutes! Hamish.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Stephen (25th Aug 2011 - 19:49:47) Hamish, you make some very good points. What is going on when the Chairwoman Eve Hope has said that all councillors can be sent the minutes but the public cannot see them? This is all nonsense and is not transparent at all. I see that on another posting it was said that Eve Hope and Michael Croucher are honest capable and reliable. Despite other postings on this site, in my opnion dishonest, incapable, unreliable might be better descriptions about producing these minutes. Michael Croucher and Eve Hope should get on this site and explain what they are up to. Who wrote the minutes, where are they, have the councllors received them? Dont be fooled by Dawn Hoskins and her motion to scrap holiday breaks in August. It is completely irrelevent and is just a great big smoke screen. Please stop the incompetency and lets have truth and transparency. Perhaps the Justice and Anti Corruption Part should investigate. Sorry, how stupid, forgot that would mean dobbing in their mates.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - graeme (26th Aug 2011 - 12:05:28) Steve, spot on yet again.the parish council are as transparant as a brick wall! poor mr Hamish only wants to read the minutes (in draft) and still they won't comply. I agree with you totally with regards to the lib dems (Hope and Croucher) would not trust them at all!

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Hamish (26th Aug 2011 - 12:53:17) Cronyism and Mendacity - is this the "modus operandi" of the Parish Council [non-political] Liberal Democrats? Where are the Minutes? Hamish.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - liz (26th Aug 2011 - 13:25:08) I suppose we must expect all this mudslinging at our Parish Council ahead of the upcoming District Council by-election. It's a pity we can't escape all this political party nonsense at Parish level. I'm quite happy to accept that there are legacy issues from our former PC which must be resolved before everything is completely open - some of the issues have been going on for years.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Stephen (26th Aug 2011 - 14:42:15) I am interested in what our current councillors are doing or not doing. This is nothing to do with politics, mudslinging or legacy issues. It is about what I believe to be the rather arrogant and blatant lack of transparency by Eve Hope, Michael Croucher, and Dawn Hoskins, our councillors, over a set of minutes. All anybody is asking for are the minutes of a meeting held on the 11th July. Please could we have some answers as to who wrote the minutes, who has the minutes, where have they gone, and why have they not been published just like any of the other minutes which are on the Parish Council website.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Hamish (26th Aug 2011 - 15:31:40) Mud-slinging? I believe you are are on the wrong thread. "District and County Elections" must be what you were looking for. It is obvious that transparency is not forthcoming from Hope, Croucher, Hoskins and Co despite their election pledges. How can anybody vote for you at District [LibDems] when you fail to comply with a rudimentary request... yet again, I must ask Where are the Minutes? Pleasant week-end to you all. Hamish

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Dadvocate (27th Aug 2011 - 01:26:58) Hamish & Pals, Do not know if you personally are acquainted with Eve Hope, Michael Croucher or Dawn Hoskins. I am very well acqainted with Eve and Michael and have never met Dawn. Eve Hope and Michael Croucher are possesed of a level of honesty and integrity that would confuse you. I suspect Mrs Hoskins is similarly endowed. Previous council goings on should be very much on the new council's agenda. Certain happenings stank. Let them rout out and expose any corruption which may (or may not) have happened, and let all of us know in due course. In the meantime, back off them and be patient

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Stephen (27th Aug 2011 - 09:06:12) I do not know who Hamish is and he is not one of my pals. This thread is about tranpsarency. I am not going to be bullied or threatended to "back off" by Dadvocate. People are asking simple questions which are not being answered. Councillors Eve Hope, Michael Croucher and Dawn Hoskins have been found wanting over their lack of transparency and all people want is the answers to basic questions about the minutes of a meeting on 11th July. Who is responsible for all this? Who wrote the minutes? Where are the minutes? Have they been sent to councillors? Why are they not published? Please can we have some answers. Lets have some TRANSPARENCY.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - john (27th Aug 2011 - 10:14:11) stephen come on no ones bullied or threatended you thats a tactic of the old council.What part of dadvoctes statement do you not understand? Two great things have happend to LBPC one is dawn hoskins the other is the eviction of newman and his chums well most of them.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Irene Ellis (27th Aug 2011 - 13:04:03) If you are so desperate to see the July mins why don't you go into the parish office and ask the clerk. He is the person that deals with it all and should be able to answer any of your questions.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - johm (28th Aug 2011 - 22:43:34) That right irene

Re: Where is the transparancy? - helen (29th Aug 2011 - 11:21:36) I think that Dawn gave an explanation which was that draft minutes should not be published until they have been agreed by the councillors who attended the last meeting, and in the case of the F and P I belive it is once every 2 months. As the person quite rightly said as the Parish office is open, when you saw that the minutes had not been published on the noticeboard why did you not ask immediately inside the Parish Office? I think that anyone with any common sense would go in and ask the people responsible for publishing the minutes surely?

Re: Where is the transparancy? - D. Advocate (29th Aug 2011 - 17:32:31) Helen, Could be that some might have a defensive agenda going back a bit.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Hamish (30th Aug 2011 - 10:55:08) Good morning, everyone! I really am not so stupid. The Parish Office was my first port-of-call! In fact, I visited several times over the following weeks and this was after Councillor Hope had remonstrated with Counciller Croucher as to why he had failed to produce the Minutes. He replied at that time that they would be done immediately in draft form. Still no sign. Either Councillor Croucher is an exceedingly slow with a pen or there is more .... obfuscation! Where are the Minutes? Ou est La Minutes! Yours aye, Hamish.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - David (30th Aug 2011 - 13:59:24) You will do well to remember that Michael Croucher is a member of "The Old Guard". And he wants to be o District Councillor!

Re: Where is the transparancy? - helen (30th Aug 2011 - 14:41:27) I am sure that if it is something urgent on there for which you must have the answer Councillor Croucher would tell you. I am sure his home phone number is available somewhere, and if you gave him your name and address and phone number I am sure he will post a copy as soon as the minutes have been agreed as correct.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - David (30th Aug 2011 - 18:49:17) You are missing the point. Minutes should be published complete for all to read not in piece meal those who wish specific information.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Dawn Hoskins (30th Aug 2011 - 21:03:34) Good Greif! I have just come back from holiday and can’t believe this thread has still got legs! Firstly, I have had no contact from you Mr Hamish so I should gather that you don’t actually want to talk to me? I am very happy to sit down with anyone who wants to know what is going on and what we are doing at the Parish Council. Obviously I can only give you my opinion, but mostly the facts can’t be slanted – they are what they are. Not liking a fact is a bit like not liking the truth. It is what it is. I have not spoken to any of my fellow Councillors as of yet, so don’t know what is going on ‘back at the ranch’ – but feel I must reply to some of the accusations that have been trown. Firstly Mr Hamish, there will no longer be any minutes published that have not been approved. This fact has been explained already. This is advice that has been followed in the aftermath of the hashed-up of a set of minutes that were put on the web site (which no Councillor in their right mind would ever have approved). You may not like this fact, but none the less, that is the state of play as it stands. Stephen – or Steve (no surname) I passed on the message as I said I would confirm the facts and report back. I spoke to the Chair of the Council and the Chair of Finance and Policy who confirmed the facts – which I posted. I hope that answers your question. The changes that have been instituted so far are nearly all to do with ‘legacy issues’ as you put it. As a new Council we had to deal almost immediately with inappropriate minutes being put on the website that no Councillor had even seen. Meeting minutes must be appropriate as well as accurate. Mr Hamish is quite correct when he states that the Chair of the Council was not happy that there had been a delay. However, any draft minutes still need to be approved as accurate before they are published – for the reasons stated above. There are currently no meetings of any sort during August. The earliest possible opportunity therefore is the next meeting of either the Full Council or the Finance and Policy Committee. I have already explained this fact. I understand that the draft minutes were going to be sent out to Councillors. This is because a number of Councillors were not happy about the delay and wanted to read them. I do not know if this has happened and have not yet checked my pigeon hole at the Parish Office. I was put in charge of taking meeting notes, which I then typed up about a week later. I have never done this before so sent them to Councillor Croucher to put in the proper format etc. As the regulations state, anything that has to be voted on has to be received 3 clear working days before the meeting. This is done so that all the papers can be read and understood before the meeting. This meant that there was only a couple of days for this to be done. I think the deadline was Tuesday 20th - which meant they would have to have been posted on the day before. There is nothing sinister – it was just a simple case of running out of time – which has coincided with a new way of doing things. David has a valid point. The approved minutes should be published as soon as they have been voted upon as accurate and appropriate. This is so that piece-meal or inaccurate information does not become accepted as the fact – which would then be later changed after they have already been read by those who checked straight away. The old system involved twice the amount of work it should have done. Put the unapproved version p – wait for approval – take down old version adjust and put up new version. Quite frankly a waste of time and effort. The new system will involve ONE publication which will not have to be edited at all. I understand that it is mud-slinging season due to the up-coming elections for District and County; however, I really think this issue is a lame duck as far as sinister motives are concerned. New Councillors = New Council = new ways of doing things. This may ruffle feathers, but once the new systems have been in place for a few months I’m sure everyone will get used to them. You can keep repeating your silliness Mr Hamish et al, but as the facts have already been spelt out and the answers given, I see no point in giving you fuel to add to your ‘anti Lib-Dem’ fire.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - helen (30th Aug 2011 - 21:10:43) Yes when they have been agreed as correct minutes it is most unusual for unapproved minutes to be available immediately from a meeting.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Hamish. (31st Aug 2011 - 13:43:16) welcome back I trust you had a great holiday. while you have been away I have been looking at old published minutes and i refer you to the full council meeting minutes of 27June 2011 ninty 2/11 this council resolves that draft minutes for all pc standing committees and working parties/group minutes or notes,are published with a draft water mark until they are formally approved agreed 8 to 1 you say that you have not spoken to any of your councillors but it would seem that you have vetoed the above motion by claiming that minutes will only be put on the web site once approved odd dont you think.I also wonder how councillors/staff can start working on various projects that where discussed at various meetings if they have to wait for the minutes to be approved.Also how can the public prepare their questions if they can not access the minutes in draft form.lastly you having taken the minutes ad having passed some law exams at uni should have been able to minute a meeting with out bothering cllr croucher perhaps you should ask the clerks for help! opps I forgot you barred them from the meeting! Please can we see the minutes Hamish

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Robin (31st Aug 2011 - 15:43:47) Hamish, Look on the website, They are there for 25th July.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Neil (31st Aug 2011 - 18:02:58) Robin, If you follow the threads and read them correctly you will gather what Hamish is saying. That is, that councillor Hoskins seems to be acting ultra vires by saying that no minutes will be published in draft form from now on. But at the meeting of the 25th June the council voted 8 to 1 that draft minutes would be published. Therefor, as you rightly point out on the 27th July the minutes have been published in draft form. So why havn't the finance and policy minutes been published? And when was the meeting to decide the minutes would not be published in draft form?

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Bdavies (1st Sep 2011 - 09:00:03) Just marvelling at this thread: Meeting is had Things are said and actions agreed Minutes drawn up Minutes published No need for a draft - no need to even mention that there is a draft. That is the end of it There are no state secrets here as it is the Local Parish Concil not the SIS.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - john (1st Sep 2011 - 10:29:31) I think its all a bit to much for poor hamish to understand!

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Hamish. (1st Sep 2011 - 11:20:46) Neil, many thanks for your lucid attempt to enlighten the readers of this thread - exactly what I am talking about. I was looking through the Minutes again last night and was rather pleased to note that the full Council Minutes for 25 July were available in draft form. I noticed at Minute 101/11 that the Chairman, Eve Hope, spoke to Councillor Croucher [Chairman of the F&P] who confirmed to her, quote, "The F&P Minutes will be sent out to morrow..." The date referred to being 26 July 2011! What is going on? Councillor Hoskins says, earlier in this thread, "Minutes will not be published in Draft form again." And yet, here we see Draft Minutes. Draft On, Draft Off, Draft On Again... Who is making the decisions here? Or, rather, who isn't. It all seems rather dysfunctional. Where are the Minutes?

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Eneida (1st Sep 2011 - 14:53:11) Anyone suffering from insomnia should read this thread last thing at night...works a treat zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Re: Where is the transparancy? - lily (1st Sep 2011 - 16:43:37) I totally agree with Eneida, very well said!

Re: Where is the transparancy? - graeme (6th Sep 2011 - 09:10:12) Lib Dems called at my house on Sunday preaching the merits of voting for them.I told them that their candidates Hope and Croucher can not even post minutes on the parish web site.when asked how can I trust them to take care of things at a higher level also last time Hope got into East Hants she was batting for a different party. if we have to rely on these two for transparancy for get it. G

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Former Liphook Resident (8th Sep 2011 - 15:35:40) I notice that the Agenda for the Finance meeting to be held on 12th September 2011 makes no mention of the meetings held on the 26th July 2011 and 10th August 2011. Were these exempt meetings as was the meeting held on 11th July? Is this why a statement has been put against the dates of the meetings held on 11th July, 26th July and 10th August that no minutes have been published. Have the minutes been circulated to all members of the Parish Council?

Re: Where is the transparancy? - helen (8th Sep 2011 - 17:37:31) Does it really matter?\It is up to the serving councillors whether they have minutes or not- are you just troublemaking?

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Former Liphook Resident (8th Sep 2011 - 19:37:09) The Publication Scheme of the Council states: Information How to obtain Timetable of meetings Website Notice Boards Hard Copy-Contact Clerk Agendas of meetings (as above) NB; this will exclude information that is properly regarded as private to the meeting. Website Hard Copy-Contact Clerk Minutes of meetings (as above) NB; this will exclude information that is properly regarded as private to the meeting. Website Hard Copy-Contact Clerk Reports presented to council meetings NB; this will exclude information that is properly regarded as private to the meeting. Website Hard Copy-Contact Clerk

Re: Where is the transparancy? - claire (8th Sep 2011 - 20:17:01) Im amazed that a 'former liphook resident' gives a flying whatsit!!

Re: Where is the transparancy? - john (8th Sep 2011 - 20:29:16) Its a shame they wernt as keen to dot the i and cross t when the old council were in there may not be sutch a mess to sort out now!

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Former Liphook Resident (8th Sep 2011 - 20:32:32) Under the Parish Council Publication Scheme Item 4 it sets out where Agendas, Minutes etc may be found. It clearly states they may be found on the web site subjection to items considered exempt not be being published.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - helen (9th Sep 2011 - 01:05:37) There are plenty of parish councils who do not have a website, they sometimes use a shared community website, Why are you are that bothered by what goes on in the posting or non posting of minutes on the website in a place you no longer live?

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Jane G (9th Sep 2011 - 07:48:15) Yawn yawn yawn! This thread is getting really boring... It seems there are a few people who are disproportionately interested in PC minutes, like there is some sort of conspiracy going on. Perhaps the posters complaining on here should make sure they stand for a seat on the council next time round! Does anyone else think that 'former Liphook resdient' is just trying to stir things up and cause trouble?...perhaps he/she is an ex-member of the old parish council, or they just seem to know an awful lot about the minutiae of council minutes...I can't think of anything more boring myself!! Well done councillors for not getting yourselves involved in this pointless discussion.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Diana (9th Sep 2011 - 10:02:51) I do so agree with Jane G\\\'s last sentance. The new council must be given a chance without previous councillers and their friends trying to provoke them

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Hamish. (9th Sep 2011 - 15:30:58) Hi Helen, John, Jane, Diana et al, You call this a boring thread? I have looked at all of your previous postings on this site and would suggest that this thread is one of more importance than one of the more usual harping/moaning forums. I note that the F&P meeting is taking place this Monday and I will certainly be there and I suggest all other contributors to this thread make the effort to turn up and question the Chairman, Coucillor Croucher, as to why there are still no minutes on the PC website and why he has put Cllr Hope into an invidious position - where she, along with him, appears to be ignoring her direct instruction to publish the Minutes in draft form on the PC website. I deduce that they are up to the usual mischief of attacking and trying to remove employees and working out how to bore the people's Councillors into submission and finally saying "I'm out of here." I doubt this will happen as these guys have character and resolve and fear for the well-being of Liphook. I note that Claire is amazed that a former Liphook resident should give a flying!!! I would also say to you "Why would a councillor who has created problems in Greatham, where he lives, become a councillor in Liphook?" Who knows former Liphook resident might also live in Greatham. If that's the case, why shouldn't he comment on this matter? This makes me worried that the council is achieving very little progress in looking after the villages interests because of their personal agendas. As still we have no minute, I suggest you book the Millennium Hall as I expect ther will be considerable numbers attending.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - liz (9th Sep 2011 - 16:54:27) More nit-picking. zzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Re: Where is the transparancy? - helen (9th Sep 2011 - 17:42:00) I agree whether or not minutes are on the website do not make people good/or bad councillors. Who we elected are supposed to be acting in the best interests of Liphook, and minutes of the Fand P are irelevant Slagging off various councillors will not endear you to the people of Liphook.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Hamish. (12th Sep 2011 - 16:05:47) Hello, All! Helen - quite to the contrary. I think thet the F&P is the most important bi-monthly meeting - because it is all about MONEY, And where does the money come from - our pockets. So if an Extraordinary Meeting is called and our paid Clerks are prevented from taking the Minutes {incidentally, they are also the Chief Financial Officers} then we must assume it is something directly to with their responsibilities as supervisors of the financial position of the Parish? True or not? Everything seems to be as abscure as ever. Why? Hopefully this can all be fully explained to-night although I expect we will all be evicted before the 'exempt' session starts and will be none the wiser as to why councillors Hope Croucher, Hoskins et al have refused to publish the draft Minutes!!!

Re: Where is the transparancy? - liz (12th Sep 2011 - 16:51:33) Hamish Give them time - there appears to be a huge number of 'legacy' issues to sort out.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Dave (12th Sep 2011 - 18:30:34) How much time do they need?

Re: Where is the transparancy? - liz (13th Sep 2011 - 09:04:59) Enough time to get the legacy legal issues resolved.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Nick (13th Sep 2011 - 19:14:32) I Note no F&P minutes on web site on 11 july 26 july 10 aug not Published Full Council last minutes 25 July Planning 18 July Highways 13 June If the minutes are not done in draft form how can the councillors check that the minutes are a true record when aked at the next meeting I am sure that somewhere in the rules the council is obliged to produce minutes for the electorate to see ( is this a ploy to make people come to the meetings ) It is wrong not to produce minutes and i am sure that as the council voted for draft minutes to still be produced and they havent been done as per F&P how the heck do the other members of the council who are not on a particular committee know what is going on ,let alone the electorate Ponder deeply on this before more excuses come up. A breach of Local Gov regs may have been commited

Re: Where is the transparancy? - NIck (14th Sep 2011 - 15:43:05) Has anyone read the Bramshott & Liphook Standing orders(Parish Council) ? Especially about the recording etc of the minutes. It may answer some of the comments made, or not. They may be out of date as the review date was 2009.

Re: Where is the transparancy? - Dawn Hoskins (14th Sep 2011 - 19:26:35) Dear Nick The minutes have been available for quite some time; however there have been problems with getting them distributed. The council are trying very hard to mend things as soon as possible. Minutes are always produced for each meeting. Always in draft form first, until voted on as accurate by the Committee concerned. This is all standard procedure. There should be a publication on-line and in paper form. Anyone should be able to ask for a paper copy at the Parish Office and they should be available on-line for all to see. As there has been a particular problem this month, paper copies were hand delivered to the Councillors so that they could be voted on at the Finance and Policy meeting which has just taken place. It is a very poor show that they have not been produced and distributed in the normal way and it has caused lots of problems. I hope and pray that this never happens again as it is not good for the reputation of the Council. If they don’t get put up on the official Council web-site soon I will just email them into the editor of this site and ask him to display them. I’m sure he won’t mind?!

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