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lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Robert (3rd Feb 2015 - 09:10:02) picking up on other recent threads on lowsley and chiltley , the estate agent told us that both lowsley and chiltley are now going to appeal… that’s 330 houses off the Longmore road and 100 houses on chiltley lane …both on green fields outside the village. I read on another thread on this website that lowsley intend to extend into the Pope family field linking onto the bramshott/headley road - with perhaps another 120 houses, again on green field? can Liphook cope? I’m not sure that I want to move to Longmore road area now, it could become traffic nightmare, even getting to the local shops will be horrendous …or should we stay outside Whitehill area and carry on driving to Liphook station? Any suggestions?

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Steve Miller (3rd Feb 2015 - 10:58:08) There is clearly a lot of uncertainty around what will eventually be built in the local area and exactly when it will happen but it seems certain that, like it or not, Liphook is destined to grow and probably by a significant degree over the medium term (say the next 10 years). This will arguably make Liphook a small town rather than a village and rather than fighting all development it seems to me that the local community should be focused on the bigger picture of achieving this growth in a way that still keeps the area a pleasant place to live. Issues such as medical provision and education places are undoubtedly important but in my opinion the key problem is traffic growth as we will soon be feeling an impact from the large developments planned in the nearby Borden area as well as coping with more local growth. Residents will doubtless have their own opinions about how this traffic should be best managed but as a Chartered Civil Engineer I would argue that some kind of ring road is the optimum long term solution. Looking at an aerial view of the village it would seem technically possible to construct a relief road running clockwise from the Portsmouth Road intersecting with Longmoor Rd and the Headley Rd and then running alongside the existing northbound A3 to the Liphook North junction. A further clockwise leg across to the Haslemere road should also be possible. Construction of such a relief road would allow the Square to be pedestrianised if that was felt to be desirable leaving the radial routes into the centre to be used only by those with business or shopping needs in the area. This could all only be achieved at a considerable cost and it is difficult to see how it might be funded although developer contributions should go at least some way towards the improvements. In my view such a road might also provide a natural boundary to even more development as there would be a strong argument that additional housing would not be allowed outside of the new road. Perhaps it might assuage some of the understandable concerns about encroachment on the national park if there was a clear limit to how far into the park that building would be permitted. The current structure of local government (compounded by the existence of the new national park) makes it difficult to see who might take the initiative in driving a more holistic approach to development. The current system seems designed to almost leave everyone equally disgruntled as it is really only developers who have an incentive to actually make anything happen.

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - ellie (3rd Feb 2015 - 11:25:34) Hi Robert, I do not think that staying in Whitehill would be any better for traffic, with the 3 thousand plus new houses planned for Bordon and Whitehill. The extra traffic in the Bordon area will make Liphook seem like a small village location! At least you would be closer to the station! I am not surprised to see that both planning applications will go to appeal. They have nothing to lose, in the current climate of encouraging house building. I do think though that when interest rates start to climb above 6 per cent, the demand for new houses will ebb. We need to encourage businesses to the area as well so there are some local jobs for the incomers

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - robert (3rd Feb 2015 - 17:44:11) Hi Ellie, thanks for your thoughts. Bordon is not an option for us personally, but I agree with you that the traffic on longmore road and the headleymay suffer even further if the bordon eco-town ever gets going. This seems like a good reason to be wary of any expansion in those parts of liphook directly linked to bordon/whitehill. With nearly 500 new homes at Lowsley/Pope field up now for grabs, I think it could turn into an absolute nightmare living close to those areas of liphook, getting in and out, suffering from commuter parking and even trying to pop out to the local shops.

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Robert (4th Feb 2015 - 20:04:54) Hi Steve, Thanks for your reply which spurred me to look over some other recent topics on the website. I see what you mean by pressures to build in this area! Good grief, I hope the people of liphook get something out of it Like you I can't see a liphook "relief road" ever happening - because cutting from longmore road to portsmouth road as some people have proposed would be quite pointless, certainly for me coming from whitehill area, but also for people from most of liphook wishing heading out towards the A3. And why would people want to cut through liphook to reach haslemere when there is a fast safer alternative? Just how would we deal with traffic coming from the north west - whitehill & bordon area caused by 330 houses at lowsly when/if they win permission at appeal plus perhaps another 120 on the adjoining Pope field? I would think that if we move to liphook we would be better off moving closer to the centre so we can avoid this nightmare getting across liphook to the station?

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - sjenner (5th Feb 2015 - 12:38:35) There are other stations. Alton Haslemere that can be reached via Lindford and the road to Haslemere via Hindhead. It has MUCH better connections than Liphook and more frequent. The fact that the expansion of Bordon does not include a station is unbelievable. Liphook cannot accommodate the sort of parking that would be required to cater for many more potential commuters. Not to mention the extra traffic that will be hurtling along Hill House Hill and the Headley road.

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Steve Miller (5th Feb 2015 - 12:56:00) Robert Whilst I agree that a link road between Longmoor Rd and Portsmouth Rd would only make a limited contribution to reducing traffic through the centre it would at least provide an alternative route for traffic travelling between Portsmouth Rd and the A3 Griggs Green junction and also traffic coming off the A3 at Griggs Green and travelling to the station. The impact of such a link would increase should Bohunt ever expand and its main entrance be relocated away from Longmoor Rd. I have seen this possibility suggested but have no idea how likely it is. I have not seen any formal traffic studies but having lived in Liphook for some 26 years it seems clear to me that the main flow of traffic through the village centre is between Headley Road and Haslemere Rd and if this flow could bypass the centre it would make a significant difference to the quality of life in and around the square. As I said in my initial post, such a link looks technically feasible to me albeit probably difficult to fund with the current local government cutbacks. My proposition was that the current drivers towards Liphook’s inevitable expansion might provide some leverage to extract money from developers in return for allowing building within the perimeter of the larger relief rd which could ultimately provide a clockwise link between Portsmouth Road and the Haslemere Rd. However significant public funding would still almost certainly be needed and I will not be holding my breath!

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - liz (5th Feb 2015 - 14:25:37) Steve's mega relief road plan would not make Liphook a pleasant place to live - certainly for those who live anywhere near these proposed roads. We would not have a village or a town - just a very large, extended road junction! Horrible! It is a nightmare scenario for Liphook and I can see no reason why the mad rush for more housing can't be stopped - at least for several years (Excluding of course those which already have permission - 600 or so?). The focus for development should now be on Bordon (as already planned) and a rail extension constructed to the new eco-town. Or reconstructed, as I believe there used to be a connection. With the chicken farm and Lowsley developments being refused, we can only hope the SDNP reject the environmental disaster that would be the Bohunt Development. It would be the end of the River Wey Conservation Area in all but name. No doubt there will be appeals but we can only hope the government inspectors would back the local councils. OK this is cloud cuckoo land but you never know. Sadly it seems some of our local councillors have been swayed by the Bohunt temporary offer of land and appear to be in favour. They will certainly not be getting my vote!!

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Kevin Jackson (5th Feb 2015 - 17:29:10) Liz, why would it be the end of the River Wey Conservation Area? The River Wey Conservation Area runs from the Mill Pond at Standford up Tunbridge Lane, on to Radford Park and to the Railway Embankment. Nowhere near Bohunt Manor Frontage Land.

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Dawn Hoskins (5th Feb 2015 - 17:53:00) Liz Which local Councillors are you talking about. If you think that you know a Councillor is in favour, then I would also like to know HOW you know this. Bearing in mind that a failure to find grounds to object is in no way an indication that the council is in favour. Lets be clear so we don\'t go around spreading rumours - which Councillors do you personally know of - from first hand experience - that are actually in FAVOUR of any of the current proposals that we are facing?

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Steve Miller (5th Feb 2015 - 18:33:39) Liz The argument is probably completely academic as I cannot see any such road coming to pass in the foreseeable future but I must disagree that such a traffic solution would not make Liphook a pleasanter place to live. Traffic on the more central parts of Haslemere, Headley, Longmoor Roads would be significantly reduced as through traffic was diverted away from the centre and as I said in my initial post, it would be possible to close the road running between the two roundabouts in the square completely which would transform the village centre overnight. Yes some people would be living close to such a new road but speeds would be relatively low and in any event most housing near the relief road would be new and therefore people moving in would know exactly what they were getting. Liphook has expanded significantly in the 26 years that my family has been living in the area and it is almost certain that it will continue to expand over the next 25 years. Unfortunately the current planning system allows the provision of new housing to be driven primarily by developers and landowners who can see large windfall profits if planning consent can be gained. My proposal for a relief road is merely one way in which future growth could potentially be steered in a direction that at least provides some benefits for the wider community. I guess that all of this relates to village plans and other community led initiatives but I fear that, to me at least, these documents are just wish lists with little idea of how any of the objectives will be realised. If I am honest my relief road probably fits into the same category!

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - robert (6th Feb 2015 - 08:57:09) Thanks to Liz Kevin and Steve helping to clarify the situation regarding traffic in Liphook from the threat of housing expansion at Lowsley plus the Pope’s adjoining field…330 plus 120 dwellings…steve you mention the village plan, but do you know if this is the same Pope that drew up the liphook village plan a while ago, which I had first thought was not too bad ? This scale of development (500 houses !!) would have a massive effect on peoiple living on or off the Longmore and Headley roads and with an appeal for housing on the east side at the berg estate, all this leaves me rather confused again and makes me wonder about moving to any of these areas? I know what the traffic is like already coming from whitehill to liphook station and I really wouldn't like to see if get much worse Steve and Liz mention a mega relief road but there is no information about this anywhere and the transport people at hampshire council tell me there are no plans or intentions for anything of the sort….so probably just local rumor and nothing more??

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - liz (6th Feb 2015 - 09:02:47) Steve I certainly agree that a broader approach is needed and hopefully we are moving towards a Neighbourhood Plan - although as you say that and other ideas will probably be just a wish list. Pity!

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - stacey (6th Feb 2015 - 09:11:23) a new road would be extremely unlikey to happen with or without houses as there is one being built in Bordon, and it is only possible because of goverment putting money in as well.

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Keith (6th Feb 2015 - 09:45:33) With regard to the question re a new rail station in Bordon, HCC and the Department of Transport spent well over £100,000 evaluating if it was possible to construct a track from Bentley to Bordon (they did also look at the possibility of reinstating a track southwards using the old Longmoor railway but this was soon ruled out as too much of the track bed had now been built on). The outcome of this investigation as that the rail link was not feasible a) on terms of cost and b) in terms of being able to add extra trains to the line between Alton and Farnham where the single line has limited capacity.

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Peter Richardson (6th Feb 2015 - 09:50:54) Liz you post on this site a great deal which is fine. However you cherry pick to which post you respond. You make statements and then do not back them up when challenged. You stated that it would be the end of the River Wey Conservation Area in all but name. Kevin asked why would it be the end of the River Wey Conservation in all but name and then went on to say that The River Wey Conservation Area runs from the Mill Pond at Standford up Tunbridge Lane, on to Radford Park and to the Railway Embankment. Nowhere near Bohunt Manor Frontage Land. In Liz's defence the comments about the River Wey were actually posted by both MJB (19th Jan) and SOS Bohunt Manor (22nd Jan) on the Bohunt Manor thread BEFORE Liz picked up on it. And as far as I can see on maps Bohunt Manor would feed the River Wey via Holly Water. In the same post you state that it seems some of our local councillors have been swayed by the Bohunt temporary offer of land and appear to be in favour. Dawn asked you to name the councillors and you have not done so. I think that if you make statements like the foregoing you must back them up, otherwise that is the way unfounded and damaging rumours start.

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - liz (6th Feb 2015 - 11:32:16) What a cheek! I reserve the right to cherry pick on a local blog.

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Dawn Hoskins (6th Feb 2015 - 13:28:52) www.easthants.gov.uk/ehdc/formsfordownload.nsf/... skip to pages 19 & 20.

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Kevin Jackson (6th Feb 2015 - 13:30:23) An interesting comment from the Editor, but it is still not clear how developing Bohunt Manor Frontage Land would mean the end of the River Wey Conservation Area. Just interested. Liz of course you have the right to cherry pick on Liphook Talkback. However if you do, your statements will lack credence if they cannot be backed up with sound evidence.

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - liz (6th Feb 2015 - 14:36:39) The water from Bohunt flows, eventually into the Wey. A bit further up than I thought and perhaps technically outside the designated 'conservation area'. It still matters if it is polluted!!

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Kevin Jackson (6th Feb 2015 - 15:35:37) Why would it be polluted. They don't pump raw sewage into rivers do they?

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - liz (6th Feb 2015 - 16:07:00) They do sometimes (legally). I believe the environmental agency has objected to the Bohunt scheme.

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Kevin Jackson (6th Feb 2015 - 17:25:54) The following are three extracts from the Environmental Agency Report: 4.2 The main watercourse, which provides natural drainage for the site, is a tributary of the River Wey. 4.6 The existing site and building drainage arrangements for the nearby Bohunt Manor are not currently known. Foul water from this area is managed on site with a Klargester Treatment Plant, which discharges directly into Bohunt Manor lake. While other residences discharge from private septic tanks into Bohunt stream. Discharge Consents and Pollution Incidents 4.17 The EA has no records of pollution incidents on the site. On reading this and I admit I am no expert, it appears as though surface water drains into the River Wey but not sewage according to 4.6. 4.17 confirms that there have not been any pollution incidents on the site.

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - robert (6th Feb 2015 - 18:38:52) Hi everyone, My rather straightforward request just asking for some local advice on our upcoming move to Liphook seems to have got hijacked to stir up speculation and personal biases about water quality! Can we please go back about my original question, as this is worrying me more and more...I am sure that you could start your own topic if you have something else you want to talk about. My question was about how much do local people think nearly 500 new houses could affect me travelling into Liphook to get to the railway station..if lowsley wins at appeal and the adjoining field belonging to the Pope's is also developed? Coming from the Headley road and Longmore road might be horrendous for me ( and anyone living in those areas) and impractical for the purposes of catching the train to work. Any suggestions on better areas to live in Liphook please?

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Finchie (7th Feb 2015 - 02:13:09) Don\'t worry - the train options are pretty limited !!! If you are working in London during typical business hours - the only options are 7.20 (ish) and 7.28 (ish). The roads are very quiet then. I might get a queue of 5 cars at the roundabout coming from Headley road. Getting the 7.45 - between 5 and 10 cars, might take 2 mins getting across the roundabouts. Get the 8.20 - school drop off time - completely stuffed - may take 15 to 20 mins to get across the roundabouts. I suspect the issues about more housing are much more infrastructure related - schools, sewerage, BT broadband etc etc. The pinch point for traffic will definitely be school times. Not sure we have enough hairdressers though - could do with a couple more ! No one seems to listen to me about getting a McDonalds - but I\'d settle for a nice Italian !! Thanks to Trevor - I think we are the only town in the UK without a Robert Dyas. Long may it last. As for the river Wey (drifts off into contamination rant ....). Apart from the later drivel Robert - hope the first paragraph helps ?! Apologies - England won - and I can\'t sleep due the adrenalin or something ;-)

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - robert (8th Feb 2015 - 14:26:12) Thanks for offering such detailed information Finchie At the time when I travel after 8am daily to the station down the headley or sometimes longmore roads the traffic build up on these roads and the square is just a nightmare. Moving closer to the station would at least mean I could help this situation by walking instead! Seriously, I don't see how even more housing (500 plus) at lowsley and the adjoining field belonging to the Pope's fronting headly road won't make the situation ten times worse. if you need more hairdressers and a big mac, I guess that you'd like to see liphook expand into a major local centre like petersfield...but maybe the england win against wales just got you over excited !

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - robert (11th Feb 2015 - 20:58:21) A new twist on my query about traffic appears to be emerging, from today’s comments on the talkback theme "The Avenue Cameras ???" There I was worried about the joint Lowsley farm/Pope family proposals for around 500 new houses chugging up my daily trip on the Headly road from Whitehill to Liphook railway station, but it now seems that a happy solution is already in the pipeline. Is it true that the Northcote developers are planning a Liphook bypass to link the new Bordon eco-village to Liphook railway station? Is this what all the cameras and traffic surveys in the last few days is all about? This bypass could help me get to the railway station instead of queuing endlessly at The Square. Although if enough of the 5,000 homes being built at Bordon use this route to get to Liphook railway station, I hope that there is better parking planned than at present. Is this scheme likely to happen? and should we put our support behind it?

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - Jane (11th Feb 2015 - 22:51:21) Robert I've not heard that one! The Northcott proposal a couple of years ago proposed a road from Longmoor Road through to the Portsmouth Road which wouldn't actually solve the traffic dilemma at all!

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - tony (12th Feb 2015 - 09:21:41) Finchie, you're right about the time it takes to get across the square at school rush time, but yesterday I spent 40 minutes trying to get out of Farnham, so we've still got a long way to go in the eyes of the planners. At least that's how I reckon they're looking at it.

Re: lowsley appeal for 330 new homes… even more to follow - stacey (12th Feb 2015 - 10:43:22) do not think that the SDNPA would encourage building of a bypass road through their land, in order to facilitate a development elsewhere. The new residents who move into new developments in Liphook, will be encouraged to walk everywhere, as planning permission is based these days on local sustainability. One reason the Chiltley Farm estate was refused, was on the grounds it was too far on foot from the village facilities. A new road is also not in the proposals for Bohunt Manor frontage land, and it would be their land it would traverse. The roundabout there is only going to be paid for when someone coughs up cash to build the medical centre, as one of the stipulations of getting permission for that, was that the developer would pay for the roundabout. Planning permission was given at least 6 years ago to build the surgery, and so far no one wants to take it on!

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