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Lorry in-training in near collision! - Dawn Hoskins (31st Jul 2009 - 16:41:03) Is it me - or are there a lot of 'in-training' lorries being driven down the narrow roads of Passfield and Liphook? Today I nearly had my wing mirror knocked off - I had to swerve into the drive of a roadside house. That is a second near miss in the last few weeks and I don't think it can be the same lorry?

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Alan (31st Jul 2009 - 16:49:32) Hi Dawn Had similar issues myself in Hollywater Road, and witnessed some VERY near misses. Alan

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Paul Robinson (31st Jul 2009 - 18:03:13) In one single journey out to Alton and back I counted four Lorry-in-training vehicles, one with a box trailer attached. Paul Robinson

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Sue Marshall (31st Jul 2009 - 18:26:03) If you look into the cabs you will see the lorries are being driven by young soldiers so I surmise the army has outsourced its HGV training. I too had a close shave with one near the Passfield junction. I have seen the lorries on the way to Petersfield and Farnham as well as round here but using the narrow roads and such huge lorries is asking for trouble.

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - jaybee (31st Jul 2009 - 20:57:18) I believe that the commercial driving training vehicles are training army drivers. I understand that they are also causing problems in Liss where the Parish Council has taken up the matter with the Commandant at Bordon Garrison. I meet them regularly and I must admit they can be quite threatening, even to an ex-army driver.

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Karen F (31st Jul 2009 - 21:01:56) Oh thank goodness somebody else has raised this point. Why do they have to do their training right smack bang in the middle of the school run? I appreciate that driver training has to take in all eventualities (is that spelt right, I have had a glass of white wine now!) but why through the middle of our village every morning??!!! Can they not spread the disruption amongst neighbouring villages??!!

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Peter Renouf (1st Aug 2009 - 12:41:57) I had an encounter with two of these vehicles in Hollywater road.One of these had a trailer followed closely by a single unit which caused me to take to the grass verge to avoid them.There seems to be an awful lot of them lately.

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Claire (3rd Aug 2009 - 21:53:15) I too have seen the the learner HGV drivers, many fresh faced and looking younger than my sons. May God bless and keep them all safe from whatever awaits them in which ever war zone they are sent. May they practise as much as they need , the use of our roads as preparation for what lies ahead is the very least we can offer to these men and women. I am humbled by the sight of them, not aggrevated.

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Jane (4th Aug 2009 - 09:49:13) Mmmmmm.................. You'll not remember when 8 squadron were based at Longmoor Camp and Liphook was a thriving village! With tanks and lorries full of soldiers in the square everyday. I'm with Claire on this one - they have to learn somewhere and the Army are part of Liphooks and the surrounding villages history. Heavy goods lorries are a problem on the Liphook to Bordon road at all times - those lorries that turn into Burgh hill are too big for the road - ever met one of those? they are not learners but I have had several encounters with the foreign drivers on the wrong side!

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Dawn Hoskins (4th Aug 2009 - 12:53:26) This thread seems to have turned into a ‘God Bless our troops” posting! I would just say this, my family are precious to me. Having to mount verges to save them from being side swiped by a bloody great oncoming lorry a foot over the white line is life threatening, not just to me and my children, but to the vehicles following me. I don’t really care who is driving the lorry – if they are putting my safely at risk then it is a problem. There must be a safer place for them until they get to a point of knowing how wide their vehicle is – that should be a basic level of competence before they are allowed to endanger our lives!

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Chris (4th Aug 2009 - 14:20:16) However much the military may be a part of our history they should practice on the motorways. As for the huge b*"&*rd transporters they should be banned from the B roads altogether.

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - dave mcgrath (4th Aug 2009 - 14:20:57) Jane, i don't know how old you are but i have been living in the village for 40 years and i don't recall tanks and army lorries trundling through the square everyday , even in the days of the osu depot! They always used the a325 (anyone remember the tank demolishing the house just up from whitehill crossroads?) Are you getting confused with the war!!!

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Sue W (4th Aug 2009 - 21:36:28) This seems to be a very emotive subject. Dave, I remember the tank demolishing the house at Whitehill, and it belonged to the parents of someone whom I worked with! I also remember someone got killed in Bordon by a tank. Yes, these extra large lorries are a problem - but like Claire - I do accept that at some time they just have to drive on 'normal' roads - they will not pick where they can drive in the future - abroad or even in the UK, so they must learn to deal with our small and tight roads. There are far more deaths on our roads by foreign lorries - as their roads are wider than ours. No one expects them to take a test to drive here. Are you going to give removal lorries a hard time? I have seen a number of double trailer lorries – no smaller (in fact it was longer) than those of the training vehicles on roads around Liphook – one was on Hill House Hill recently. Do you propose to stop these as well? If you try to apply conditions to one – then you must do it to all. There is also an increase in BSM cars - especially around Bordon area - one morning I counted 4 different training vehicles - some so poor at car control that a few lessons on an industrial estate would have been the order of the day. I sat there for 2 traffic light changes while the pupil got it together and moved off!! That’s life. If nothing else it teaches 'experienced and novice drivers' to expect the unexpected. If these large vehicles are now know to so many - just drive with that in mind.

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Chrisanne Adamson (6th Aug 2009 - 11:50:38) I think the emphasis has to be on safety for ALL road users. Whilst I agree that army personnel in our area have little alternative but to use the lanes, I have faced these on-coming vehicles on a daily basis, and more often than not, they are driving on my side of the road causing me to slow right down to almost a stop, in fear of being forced off the road. It's frightening. Maybe the answer is for better roadside maintenance. If the trees and hedges were cut back there would be no need for these vehicles to be in the middle of the road.

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - P Weyland (7th Aug 2009 - 09:32:10) I grew up in Liphook in the early 70s and my mum always remembers one of my first words being 'Army lorry' !

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Paul W (14th Aug 2009 - 14:35:27) To get back to the origional query, I don't think anybody wishes any ill on our young troops, but these training lorries are becoming a menace in my humble opinion. Of course, everyone needs to learn and all the lorries pay their road tax etc, but the number of these vehicles passing through our village is just ridiculous. Driving through Liphook many times a day, I can almost guarentee to pass or follow at least one, and recently passed five between Lindford and Liphook within five minutes. I certainly don't remember seeing the army's own L-plate clad vehicle passing through Liphook with such regularity. The fact is, Liphook is too small for the amount of these vehicles passing through it. I have seen them with wheels over the white lines and on the pavement. Its dangerous!

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Dawn Hoskins (15th Aug 2009 - 11:28:35) I think that this should be put on the agenda at the next Parish Council meeting. I’m sure it would be quite possible to initiate some sort of dialogue with the company that is running this vehicle training. If they are aware that it endangers parishioners on a regular basis and is raising concern they may decide, in the interest of public relations, to alter their routes. It is certainly worth a try.

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Name given (16th Aug 2009 - 22:31:22) I have served in the armed forces My sons are now also serving and will shortly deploy to Afghanistan for 8 months Without the courageous drivers of the Royal Logistic Corps I in my time and now my sons and their comrades will not get the ammo to defend themselves and hunt the Taliban, nor the rations and water so essential to their well being and survival in Forward Operating Bases nor will they get the fuel and parts for the vehicles which are so important and nor will they get the support services so vital to bringing them home safely. So come on.............. Where are these drivers supposed to get their training and when. On motorways I heard someone say.........There aren't too many motorways in Afghanistan or Belize. Not during the school run hours someone else has suggested...... can someone explain why it seems impossible for children to walk to school, thereby reducung the number of vehicles on the roads at these times especially when large numbers of children live within 3 Kilometres of their school and could easily do so. Nobody moaned when 8 Sqd RCT and the RE were at Longmoor and did their training on the local roads as well as the driver schools at SEME nor when the OSSU was in full swing in Midhurst Road and lorries arrived from all over the south at various times of the day. Nobody moaned when Connaught Hospital and Camp Huron were fully functional and they needed their constant lory loads of stores and equipement. For the benefit of all NIMBYS .............. For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Chuck him out, the brute!" But it's "Saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot; An' it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' anything you please; An' Tommy ain't a bloomin' fool -- you bet that Tommy sees!

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Jaybee (17th Aug 2009 - 08:50:24) I also served in the army and drove army vehicles in this area. I agree that there were virtually no complaints when 8 sqd. RCT, SEME and other army driving units did their training on local roads in this area. I suggest that the reason that there was no complaints was due to the fact that the standard of instruction was very high, given by army instructors, in military vehicles. Todays training is outsourced to a civilian company using vehicles which appear more threatening than their army counterparts. Little respect is given to civilian drivers.. This standard of driving might be acceptable on active service but not in UK.

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Sumi Olson (17th Aug 2009 - 08:51:37) Fully support the work of our armed forces overseas and am saddened with each news report of casualties so don't misunderstand this post. HOWEVER... we are a village with narrow streets and pavements. Pushing a double buggy throughout Liphook is not the most enjoyable experiences when cars park on pavements, hedges are not trimmed back and when cars & lorries speed past (over the speed limit but that's another post). My little boy has been scared stiff at times by big vehicles coming too close to him and I have to hold my breath at times. It's a sad day when one is nervous about walking through one's own village... Surely what would work is a compromise on times and numbers going through the village. Learners would get their valuable training and we won't feel unsafe in our own village.

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Chris (17th Aug 2009 - 09:44:21) "On motorways I heard someone say.........There aren't too many motorways in Afghanistan or Belize". Just how much of Afghanistan is leafy country lanes with wooded, inaccessible borders? Most of the roads out there are dirt tracks with no barriers or road markings. It would make more sense to try and replicate this on MOD land away from normal traffic. Training is one thing but training at the expense of road safety is entirely UNACCEPTABLE!

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Karen F (17th Aug 2009 - 10:13:59) I completely agree with Sumi. The point I raised about lorries using the village at school run time was that the Square is a dangerous place between 8.30 - 9.00am most mornings, rat running traffic and children trying to cross the square on the zebra crossing. I can assure you that more parents would walk with their children if there was less traffic and if drivers kept to the speed limit. It is frightening for small children to be passed by speeding lorries and cars and does make you feel very unsafe even on the pavements. Again, completely support the armed forces and have every sympathy for the training situation but surely we need to find a compromise?

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Paul W (17th Aug 2009 - 19:46:29) Once again... Nobody is wishing any ill on our young troops whatsoever, and if they are posted abroad we all hope they return safely. But clearly there are very valid concerns being raised over the impact to the rest of us. These vehicles are probably passing through Liphook at the rate of thirty times a day! They are just too big and too frequent for a village the size of Liphook. I have followed these vehicles passing through the square with their rear wheels on the pavement. Is this impact fair to the hundreds of young children who will shortly be making their way to school. The possible consequence's are frightening, and I can't see how using 'more appropriate' roads could be frowned upon. I have e-mailed the parish council via the link on the left of this page, and the reply states that if there are enough voices of concern, then the matter will be on the agenda of the next council meeting on September 7th. I urge you all to voice your concern!

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Sumi Olson (18th Aug 2009 - 14:55:23) Paul W - thanks for the useful reminder to actually TELL the Parish Council about what I think, rather than assume that by merely posting on this website, they will do something by magic!!! I've now written an email via their details on this site and I've registered my concerns about the lorries' impact on the village. It's all too easy to vent off here and expect the PC to act upon what's written! Thanks again Sumi

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Chrisanne Adamson (19th Aug 2009 - 10:50:53) I too wish all of our troops the best training and support they can get, but as it has been pointed out, these training vehicles are privately owned, and in my opinion do not need to use Hollywater Road (where I have had many scary encounters) or the tiny roads in Liphook. I think a more acceptable all round solution would be to continue down the Petersfield Road from Bordon to the roundabout at Greatham and then go up the A3 and back again. Resulting in minimum risk for pedestrians and motorists alike. At least these roads are wide enough and suitably marked. Chris

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Sue W (19th Aug 2009 - 15:50:17) I think you will find these training vehicles - on all roads within at least a 7 mile radius of Bordon. They do not particularly target Liphook!. I think it has been said before that Liss has complained about it too. I have also noticed that most are now only one lorry - and not the double units that make these so much more alarming. I suppose that for test purposes they would be required to have the hardest routes with the longest vehicle? Perhaps they could be persuaded to have a purpose built 'small road, multiple roundabouts' site? I also get the feeling that the problems of Liphook is not just these training lorries - but lorries in general? [editor - passed by a double one this morning on Headley Road - BTW]

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - dee (19th Aug 2009 - 16:00:35) Hi Yes I know they have to train somewhere. I was approaching the junction of the Headley Road with the square about an hour ago, coming towards me 1 of the said vehicles and behind it another towing a unit, had to wait where I was part way down the Headley Road until they got on their side of the road. Dee

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Sue W (19th Aug 2009 - 22:56:10) Ed I did not say there were NO double units - All I said was that over the past week - I have encountered much more single units than what was before rather a lot of double units?

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Dawn Hoskins (27th Aug 2009 - 15:00:09) I just wanted to ask - what did they do to learn to drive their lorries before this company took over? Does any one know? Presumably the teaching has been on going for decades but this problem is only a recent occurance. So we do know that it can be done without putting pedestrians and drivers at risk.

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Sumi Olson (3rd Sep 2009 - 21:13:09) The lorries appear to be back this week after a summer break...

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - george (10th Sep 2009 - 10:57:33) Can I ask why all the people who complain about the Lorrys in Driver Training did not go to the Council Meeting on the 7th Sept where this item was on the agender, to complain nothing will get done unless you write to the council or go to the meetings.I happend to be the only one there complaining.

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Sumi Olson (13th Sep 2009 - 08:57:48) Hi! see my previous post below. Pleased to say I received a reply to my email. I take your point about addressing the issue with the PC - it is true that way we can hope things will get actioned. However, like too many others I can't make the PC meetings for the times they are scheduled due to family commitments but I have written or phoned if I had something to discuss. Cheers Sumi Paul W - thanks for the useful reminder to actually TELL the Parish Council about what I think, rather than assume that by merely posting on this website, they will do something by magic!!! I've now written an email via their details on this site and I've registered my concerns about the lorries' impact on the village. It's all too easy to vent off here and expect the PC to act upon what's written! Thanks again Sumi

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Dawn Hoskins (13th Sep 2009 - 10:46:14) Hi George Like many, I was not able to attend the meeting on the 7th. I was planning to but the first day of school term unearthed a million and one things that should have been done (but weren’t) during the break – and I just ran out of hours in the day! However, I did know it was on the agenda and that satisfied me. If I know that an item is going to be discussed, then I know that most of our points of view will be addressed. The clerk [and others] read this site every day and monitor opinion and I’m quite sure that they do this for a reason! I’m glad that you did attend though and will read the minutes of the meeting on line. If any councillors are reading and will tell us what was said / decided upon that would be good too.

Re: Lorry in-training in near collision! - Chris (13th Sep 2009 - 10:46:15) I also e mailed the PC asking them to review the situation and received a reply stating that they would at the next meeting. My daily commute does not always allow me to attend these and other local interest meetings.

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