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The Rec: Custodian Trustees - Finchie (29th Oct 2014 - 22:52:48) Just started this up as I hadn't missed the subtle point about various agendas and motives around the Willows related to building drop in centres for the elderly. Declaration of interest: I am closer to needing a drop-in center than when I used a nursery ! This link is interesting: bramshottandliphook-pc.gov.uk/general-information/custodian-trustees I\'m assuming that because the land was purchased by public subscription it must be used for the interests of the public. Big assumption though. Can anyone confirm though (or volunteer to go to the council offices and get a copy of the deeds of the land held in trust by the PC as I\'m really interested in confirming it must be used in the interest of the public - unless the offices are open on Sat as I work in London during the week). If the intent of use is not for the public - there will be a conflict of interest which the PC will have had to have figured out how to deal with the situation many times in the past - as the PC must represent the interest of the taxpayers. If the land is for the benefit of the public, there should be full, open, transparent and public engagement and consultation on all matters. Including any initiatives and intent around building anything. Just sayin\' ... Cheers, Finchie

Re: The Rec: Custodian Trustees - Kat (30th Oct 2014 - 16:13:18) Looking at your link, its a charity, so if you go to the Charity Commission website and type in the name you can find the details. I did and the number is 301766.

Re: The Rec: Custodian Trustees - Peter R (30th Oct 2014 - 16:52:49) How can we, the public ensure that when the Beacon Building's future is discussed this will take place at a meeting which is open to the public. Who should we lobby to make sure that it does? Also, is it likely that in the event of a request to see a copy of the Deeds is made, this will be complied with. The Clerk would not let anyone see a copy of the surveyor's report even though Cllr Robinson at the meeting stated that a copy would be made available. There is too much unnecessary secrecy going on and I feel very strongly that some of the parish councillors have hidden agendas on too many things, certainly as far as the Beacon Building is concerned. The planning application to favour development on Chiltley Lane is another example - secret meeting before the official Parish Council meeting so that when the item came up for discussion is was a foregone conclusion in favour of development. Sorry to digress but this is all tied in with the lack of transparency currently being demonstrated by some councillors on B&LPC.

Re: The Rec: Custodian Trustees - Shauna Horsley (30th Oct 2014 - 21:25:26) Will call into the Parish Council Offices tomorrow to ask for Deeds and Charity details, together with a copy of the Surveyors Report... not holding my breath, but will let you know how it goes

Re: The Rec: Custodian Trustees - helen (31st Oct 2014 - 00:08:25) I do not follow what is implied by finding out that the recreation ground is registered as a charity? Charities still recieve incomes from various sources, The church of England is probably a registered charity, and they are one of the largest landowners in england, probably second only to the Duchy of Cornwall, which has the Princes Trust, I think also a charity, which is a huge money spinner now! I have a friend who rents a cottage owned by the church of England in Hertfordshire, she has a commercial normal tenancy lease, and pays them the local going rent? maybe the landlord, the vicar, has more scruples than the average landlord but he does collect a good rent from the property! included in the accounts of the PCC every month! A lot of Parish councils own burial sites, they charge a fortune to people to bury relatives and allow gravestones on the site. No one expects this to be at peppercorn prices just because the custodians of the land are a Parish Council?.

Re: The Rec: Custodian Trustees - Kevin Jackson (31st Oct 2014 - 09:34:47) Good luck Shauna - do let us know if you are successful.

Re: The Rec: Custodian Trustees - Finchie (31st Oct 2014 - 18:42:30) Thanks. Useful. The charity bit means that detailed accounts are not needed for revenue below £10k. Probably not an issue and the best way to structure - from my brief look the last few years have just been below £10k, which is handy. My only point above is that so long as the deeds and bequeathment are "for public" benefit, I see no situation where anything can be behind closed doors and full transparency is a must (given that what our PC decided when setting things up in Standing Orders - rightly so). For ANYTHING regarding the Rec. If closed sessions are being held inappropriately by the councillors we voted in (I did vote) and are not running things appropriately (I don't know) there are many things we can do about it. I have no idea if this is genuinely the case, but worth poking around based on what I've read to date on Talkback - enough questions to get clarity. We need to put questions, in writing, in advance, to the PC to answer that - that way the question can't be avoided. I'll check that with someone who I know who and understands the process VERY well ;-) The easiest action will be we (you) have the chance to do something about it in May with the elections. Our collective challenge is we need more candidates to stand who are prepared to do something about it in their own time and Openness and Transparency is their primary objective. Happy Weekend. Cheers, Finchie

Re: The Rec: Custodian Trustees - Finchie (31st Oct 2014 - 19:17:56) And just to explain the potential conflict of interest from a legal topic note on Basic Charity Law... "Council officers and employees have a duty to ensure that they act in the best interests of tax payers and trustees have a duty to act in the best interests of the charity and its beneficiaries. These duties can and very frequently do, conflict. A conflict can arise in a number of situations and a classic example is the sale or lease of land by one body to the other. For example, trustees leasing or selling land to a council are under a duty to obtain the best price or rent. At the same time, council officers or employees are under a duty to ensure that tax payers's money is spent prudently. Another example is where contracts are agreed by one body to the other. Clearly it is extremely difficult to comply with both duties art the same time". Go figure. I can't get my head around this at the moment as the PC should act in the best interest of the taxpayer AND they are the Trustee (PC are poacher and gamekeeper). But I think this is is a common situation as Parish Councils are generally a body that continues (vs individual trustees who pass away) so PCs are often appointed Trustees. I must be missing something. As you point out Helen, clearly the CofE makes it work ! But they have no obligation to the tax-paying public which the PC do !! I think they only have obligations to one person (answers on a postcard). So while I figure the above out (or someone helps me) the demand for "Openness & Transparency serving the public" route is much easier for my simple head ! Cheers, Finchie

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